Sitting while sleepy

[Kaitan]

I've struggled the last couple of days to sit in the evening, I feel very sleepy and if I sit then I'll just daydream/sleep and not really sit in the here and now. Maybe I still have jet lag; a solution that it occurs me is to sit earlier, but what to do when feeling like that, despite being willing to sit? Do you just sit as much as you can, maybe 10min? (Better some than nothing)

Gasshō

stlah, Kaitan

[Bion]

It happens to me a lot, so just take my next words as the silly thoughts of someone else who is sometimes sleepy, and nothing else.

Early morning sits, the zazenkai at 2 or 3 am.. Some things are beyond our control, but I do try to avoid very sleepy sits. BUT .. a sleepy sit is not a bad sit.. just sleepy. Master Dogen says to “open the eyes a few time” in a row to create a little draft in your eyes to wake you up haha sounds funny, but .. on a more realistic note, just sit with the sleepiness, straighten your posture, keep your eyes open, and if you doze off, snap out of it and keep sitting.

Gassho
Sat and lah

[RobO]

I have been experiencing similar, in my afternoon sits. Having read old posts here, I think for me, during the sits, the best I can do is not resist, and accept that sleepy is where I am. But also I think there is a signal here, something may need adjusting outside of zazen. Zazen feels almost like a sensitive instrument, picking up small things that otherwise I wouldn't notice!

I don't know if this helps, but just to say, "me too"!

Sorry ran long.

Gassho, Rob
Sat / lah

[Kaitan]

It happens to me a lot, so just take my next words as the silly thoughts of someone else who is sometimes sleepy, and nothing else.

Early morning sits, the zazenkai at 2 or 3 am.. Some things are beyond our control, but I do try to avoid very sleepy sits. BUT .. a sleepy sit is not a bad sit.. just sleepy. Master Dogen says to “open the eyes a few time” in a row to create a little draft in your eyes to wake you up haha sounds funny, but .. on a more realistic note, just sit with the sleepiness, straighten your posture, keep your eyes open, and if you doze off, snap out of it and keep sitting.

Gassho
Sat and lah

I'm sure you're familiar with the sudden "lashing backs" upon waking up. That's when I know I'm not having a good sit.

Gasshō

stlah, Kaitan

[Bion]

I'm sure you're familiar with the sudden "lashing backs" upon waking up. That's when I know I'm not having a good sit.

Gasshō

stlah, Kaitan

No such thing as a “not good sit”

Gassho
Sat and lah

[Kaitan]

No such thing as a “not good sit”

Gassho
Sat and lah

Riiiiiight

Gasshō

stlah, Kaitan

[Kaitan]

I have been experiencing similar, in my afternoon sits. Having read old posts here, I think for me, during the sits, the best I can do is not resist, and accept that sleepy is where I am. But also I think there is a signal here, something may need adjusting outside of zazen. Zazen feels almost like a sensitive instrument, picking up small things that otherwise I wouldn't notice!

I don't know if this helps, but just to say, "me too"!

Sorry ran long.

Gassho, Rob
Sat / lah

Thanks, glad I'm not the only one



stlah, Kaitan

[Jundo]

It happens to me a lot, so just take my next words as the silly thoughts of someone else who is sometimes sleepy, and nothing else.

Early morning sits, the zazenkai at 2 or 3 am.. Some things are beyond our control, but I do try to avoid very sleepy sits. BUT .. a sleepy sit is not a bad sit.. just sleepy. Master Dogen says to “open the eyes a few time” in a row to create a little draft in your eyes to wake you up haha sounds funny, but .. on a more realistic note, just sit with the sleepiness, straighten your posture, keep your eyes open, and if you doze off, snap out of it and keep sitting.

Gassho
Sat and lah

Yes, it is better to sit when not too sleepy but ... if unavoidable ... then we sit as what is, accepting what is.

Even so, Dogen's teacher, Rujing, might come over and hit you with his slipper, as he was prone to do to sleepers! Best not to sleep, but to sit upright, alert and awake.

If a little drowsy, I like to breathe a little deeper, and to stretch the neck upward just a little bit. Also, this is one of the reasons that Zen has such a close connection to the tea world!

We do have several threads on what to do if this condition persists, but the basic idea is that ... your body is telling you, GET SOME MORE REST!

Gassho, J

stlah

[Doshin]

Thanks all for sharing your thoughts. They give me ideas. I usually feel sleepy during my evening sits because I get up very early (too early but I have three dogs demanding food and attention!) I have adjusted some by sitting in the morning when I am more awake. So when we are sitting together and it my evening time forgive me if my head bobs

Doshin
Stlah

[Chikyou]

I have been experiencing similar, in my afternoon sits. Having read old posts here, I think for me, during the sits, the best I can do is not resist, and accept that sleepy is where I am. But also I think there is a signal here, something may need adjusting outside of zazen. Zazen feels almost like a sensitive instrument, picking up small things that otherwise I wouldn't notice!

I don't know if this helps, but just to say, "me too"!

Sorry ran long.

Gassho, Rob
Sat / lah

I never thought of it that way, but you're right! My zazen definitely ebbs and flows with my life - whether I'm lost in thought, or mind is racing, or body is restless, or I'm perfectly still. Perhaps I should make note when it happens and see if something is off in my life that I may not have taken note of (and fix it if I can, but if not, accept it.)

Gassho,
SatLah
Chikyō

[Seijin]

I would say sit as much as suits the needs you have right now.
Priorirtize sleep when that is needed...
Eating when that is needed...and so on.
And then sit.

Well, I get sleepy sometimes a good posture and slightly open eyes , as well as altering with kinhin helps me.
And I note to myself that this sleepyness is a sign I need to prioritize my sleep the upcoming night. And I also think- If I am not able to focus during zazen Im probably less atentive in serving others as well in the state Im in.(Listening to my children and clients etc). That gives me some guidence in what I need to do.

🙏Seijin

[Seiko]

I feel very sleepy

As a novice I can only speak for myself, nothing I say is intended as teaching.

When Zazen tells me to sleep, I sleep. When I awake, Zazen is there waiting, still available, welcoming me back.

Also - my body doesn't use vitamin D and B12 efficiently so I was prescribed high dose supplements. If you are tired at other times too, perhaps get some medical tests - it may be a vitamin deficiency or some other issue - with a simple fix.

Gasshō
Seiko
stlah

[Kenku]

Perhaps Treeleaf needs some kind of virtual or remote kyosaku.

sat&lah

[Jundo]

Perhaps Treeleaf needs some kind of virtual or remote kyosaku.

sat&lah

We were experimenting with this Kyosaku stick that would plug into the USB, clip onto the back of the Zafu, and had several settings and a timer. Unfortunately, we had to recall them after several serious injuries among our members:

(not)

Gassho, J

stlah



tsuku.jpg

[Kenku]

[Chikyou]

We were experimenting with this Kyosaku stick that would plug into the USB, clip onto the back of the Zafu, and had several settings and a timer. Unfortunately, we had to recall them after several serious injuries among our members:

(not)

Gassho, J

stlah



tsuku.jpg

I know you were joking but I actually have a grow light in my zendo for my plants (am LED one and I have checked on its safety for me, don't worry!) and it's on a timer. It wakes me up in the morning and my morning sit is the first thing I do after brushing my teeth. Basking in its glow is one of my favorite parts of my day - it turns out, full spectrum grow lights (without UV, which would be harmful) aren't too dissimilar to therapy lights.

Gassho,
SatLah
Chikyō