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Thread: 9/18 - SHOBOGENZO-ZUIMONKI - 3-2 to 3-6

  1. #1

    9/18 - SHOBOGENZO-ZUIMONKI - 3-2 to 3-6

    Some very nice sections this week, fleshing out some of Dogen's perspectives on lay folks and other matters ...

  2. #2

    Re: 9/18 - SHOBOGENZO-ZUIMONKI - 3-2 to 3-6

    3-2: "I donít think that the names provisionally used to distinguish monks and nuns from lay people are at all important." -- Dogen reminds us that names are just labels and titles do not make one more or less "enlightened". Whether you are a monk or a layman it's the state of your intention and sincerity that matters most. That being said, Dogen obviously has his preferences for the monastic life!

    3-3: This theme has cropped up frequently so far and Dogen repeats it: Do good not because you seek recognition or fame but because it's the right thing to do. Don't act out of ego.

    3-4: More possessions means a more complicated life. This is so horribly obvious it hurts and yet we always forget it to our detriment. If you own nothing then you have no reason to get jealous or angry at someone else for taking "your" stuff! Anyone ever steal "your" parking space? That's a perfect example. You never owned it but the minute you put that box around it in your brain that says "MINE" you suffer.

    3-5: Interesting passage when made applicable to our daily life. If you do what you do for the sake of just doing it, then there shouldn't be a need for you to seek position or accolades. Of course, we also live in secular society where "the squeaky wheel gets the grease". That's the koan of modern life, I suppose; because if you don't ask you don't get but what need is there for more when everything is already perfect as it is? I sense this is where Jundo's "acceptance without acceptance" comes in handy...

    3-6: Have compassion towards others. Do not be scornful or critical of your subordinates. If you do so, you create karma. Dogen cites an interesting passage that demonstrates the Buddha taking full responsibility for the slander and hatred that others have shown him. He simply states that because of his past actions when he was scolding and fault-finding he now must bear the fruit of that karma. I like seeing passages like this about the Buddha because people often forget the lesson of Hyakujo's fox and think that the Buddha somehow escaped karma. On more than one occasion in the scriptures it appears the Buddha lamented his karma and bore it gracefully. This makes him all the more appealing to me personally because it frames him as an extraordinary man, not a god.

  3. #3

    Re: 9/18 - SHOBOGENZO-ZUIMONKI - 3-2 to 3-6

    3-2 : I think the "correct view" of which Dogen spoke refers to the intention of the practitioner. For the laity, who does not intend to make monastic vows but practices buddha-dharma, the Way is attainable. In other words, the Way is all inclusive and available to all sentient beings. On the other hand, if the decision has been made to follow a monastic practice, the Way is unattainable while still grasping to life outside of the monastic life. Your commitment's become divided and neither way is attainable. Whatever path you choose in life, commit to it whole heartedly. And, be kind to yourself if you need to change paths. Life is trial and error.

    3-3 : Put all others first. If this was the standard for all beings, your needs would come before everyone else's; therefore, you would not want for anything. It's the ultimate in taking care of yourself by forgetting yourself. A way of life that is unachievable until someone makes the first step.

    3-4 : I think the word "poor" here can be easily misinterpreted (but when has language ever been exact). I think poor here is used like saying claim nothing as your own or take no personal ownership of things at the exclusion of ownership by others. What would it be like to see the Corvette driven by your neighbor and know that, upon asking, it would be yours to drive.

    When we own things to the exclusion of others, we breed anger, resentment, and hostility; a way that will eventually burn itself out of existence.

    3-5 : Worldly titles of recognition are irrelevant when seeking the Way. As Dogen says: "Just awaken to the Way; be concerned with nothing else."

    3-6 : Again, good people or bad people, upper caste people or lower caste people, rich people or poor people, these are worldly, fabricated titles of no consequence to awakening to the Way. Just as the scorpion would sting you for releasing it from a bucket prison, we should endeavor to do as the Buddha because it is buddha-nature.

    Secondly, when in a position that requires discernment of others, choose a kind and compassionate way to guide them. Harsh words only create a karma that is unpleasant when it comes back to you. If you don't want the boat to rock, don't make waves.

  4. #4

    Re: 9/18 - SHOBOGENZO-ZUIMONKI - 3-2 to 3-6


    Let me just mention that, based on the polling results so far, I am planning to put the Book Club - Shobogenzo Zuimonki on hiatus until after we complete the Precepts Study for Jukai ...

    ... any objectors, speak now or hold your peace.

    Of course, none of that is going to stop anyone from reading ahead, or reading something else, on their own! 8)

    Gassho, The Librarian

  5. #5

    Re: 9/18 - SHOBOGENZO-ZUIMONKI - 3-2 to 3-6

    Works for me since the schedule was getting a bit crowded...and gives me time to re-read the sections that I didn't completely understand, which is most of them.

  6. #6

    Re: 9/18 - SHOBOGENZO-ZUIMONKI - 3-2 to 3-6

    Hi everyone! :wink:

    I just wanted to share the fact that for me it is going to be difficult to fully be part of the Ango, the Precept study, the rakusu sewing, and the book club at the same time... with the job and the studies on the other hand... and above all with the fact that I still haven't Internet at home... :?

    So, i'm a bit sad but I'll follow the study of the zuimonki with less attention, or at least a less active participation...
    In fact, I wonder how jundo do so much things at the same time... Do you sleep jundo? :lol:

    Gassho to you folks,


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