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Thread: Do We Need A Mokuhyo (or Moktak)

  1. #1

    Do We Need A Mokuhyo (or Moktak)

    Question

    Is a motak used during chants or in that only in the monastery setting?


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  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Talib View Post
    Question

    Is a motak used during chants or in that only in the monastery setting?
    The Japanese version is called a "Mokugyo," wooden fish, because of the shape. They can be used for home chanting (unless the next door neighbors mind ) but are purely optional, up to what you feel.



    The Korean Moktak is good too ...



    A nice piece of plain wood that makes a nice sound, and a drum stick also is fine. Or nothing.

    Gassho, J

    STLah
    ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

  3. #3
    PS - I hope it is okay, I moved this to its own thread.
    ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

  4. #4
    I have been looking around the second hand stores here looking for a nice big one! Don’t think I need it, but I want it and I’m ok with that.

    Gassho
    Mark
    ST


    Buddhists conclude: “I am aware, therefore I neither am nor am not”
    "We may hear and understand as well, yet in our daily lives still be subject to our habitual ways. And so we do zazen to cut all of this habitualization away. If we don’t cut, we end up carrying more and more burdens around."
    Finding Our Essence of Mind

  5. #5
    I wonder if the Motak is more tender than the Mokugyo. I mean I soaked that think in salt water for hours, and it's still pretty tough to chew. Definitely not my favorite fish; I'd go with Salmon.

    Happy Thursday

    Gassho

    Risho
    -stlah
    Last edited by Risho; 09-23-2021 at 01:18 PM.

  6. #6
    They’re really good for keeping the pace. Chants are done at a certain speed. The sounds let you know to go faster or slower. A steady pace is normal. At least in the Hua Yen school.
    In the monastery two of the bigger ones were on each side of the alter. The leader had a bell. So everything had a reason
    Anyhoo the moktak I use is like the smaller one.


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  7. #7
    Definitely not my favorite fish;


    gassho, Shokai
    stlah
    仁道 生開 - Jindo Shokai "Open to life in a benevolent way"
    May we all grow together in our knowledge of the Dharma

  8. #8
    By the way, if ya want to see a MOKUGYO, check out this whale which Kyonin and I encountered during his pilgrimage to Japan, at the successor to Master Dogen's original temple ... Kōshō-ji ...



    Gassho, J

    STLah
    ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Jundo View Post
    By the way, if ya want to see a MOKUGYO, check out this whale which Kyonin and I encountered during his pilgrimage to Japan, at the successor to Master Dogen's original temple ... Kōshō-ji ...
    This is amazing and I want it! We have quite a few antique stores around me, but the few I saw already had 'sold' notices on! I'm keeping my eye out!

    I like the idea of drums (or anything to keep rhythm) in groups because they can really help everyone feel more comfortable with when to chant, which in turn makes them chant louder. (Certainly does that for me)

    Gassho
    Mark
    ST
    "We may hear and understand as well, yet in our daily lives still be subject to our habitual ways. And so we do zazen to cut all of this habitualization away. If we don’t cut, we end up carrying more and more burdens around."
    Finding Our Essence of Mind

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by WanderingIntrospection View Post
    This is amazing and I want it!
    Do not be attached to "Zen stuff" and trinkets. It is just more stuff, material possessions. Stuff and toys are not needed for Just Sitting and Zen Practice.

    In any case, you wife might object to that thing in the living room or garage.

    Gassho, J

    STLah
    ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

  11. #11
    It's ok, we'll put in the living room right where we have this thing. I won it years ago in a contest, and my wife hates it!

    182DE47D-4F18-4098-B410-483827D71B1A_4_5005_c.jpeg

    Gassho

    Risho
    -stlah

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Jundo View Post
    Stuff and toys are not needed for Just Sitting and Zen Practice.
    That’s exactly how I feel. From time to time I am tempted to buy some Zen or Buddhist trinket but then question my motivation. Inevitably I remind myself that it is just stuff and not critical to my practice.


    Tairin
    Sat today and lah
    泰林 - Tai Rin - Peaceful Woods

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Tairin View Post
    That’s exactly how I feel. From time to time I am tempted to buy some Zen or Buddhist trinket but then question my motivation. Inevitably I remind myself that it is just stuff and not critical to my practice.


    Tairin
    Sat today and lah
    And yet, and yet ... I must confess to being a bit of a hypocrite on this, as I always have an eye for Zen and Buddhist things in second hand stores and such around here in Japan. Our Zendo and my house are filled with little Buddha statues, bells, incense burners and other stuff ... mokugyo too.

    This is a case where I just have to think that, if I lost all the stuff, it would still be okay. So, I am not too attached to the stuff.

    Gassho, J

    STLah
    Last edited by Jundo; 09-25-2021 at 12:14 AM.
    ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Jundo View Post
    And yet, and yet ... I must confess to being a bit of a hypocrite on this, as I always have an eye for Zen and Buddhist things in second hand stores and such around here in Japan. Our Zendo and my house are filled with little Buddha statues, bells, incense burners and other stuff ... mokugyo too.

    This is a case where I just have to think that, if I lost all the stuff, it would still be okay. So, I am not too attached to the stuff.

    Gassho, J

    STLah
    Ha! I saw your previous post earlier and genuinely said to myself (in your voice) : “and yet.. and yet… “

    SatToday
    Bion
    美音

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  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Jundo View Post
    And yet, and yet ... I must confess to being a bit of a hypocrite on this, as I always have an eye for Zen and Buddhist things in second hand stores and such around here in Japan. Our Zendo and my house are filled with little Buddha statues, bells, incense burners and other stuff ... mokugyo too.

    This is a case where I just have to think that, if I lost all the stuff, it would still be okay. So, I am not too attached to the stuff.

    Gassho, J

    STLah
    I am the guy who would be found standing in front of a row of identical Buddha statues trying to pick the best one.

    Sometimes the best way to put down one’s baggage is to not pick it up in the first place. For me it is better to keep it simple and limit the accoutrements.


    Tairin
    Sat today and lah
    泰林 - Tai Rin - Peaceful Woods

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Bion View Post
    Ha! I saw your previous post earlier and genuinely said to myself (in your voice) : “and yet.. and yet… “

    SatToday


    I have a few buddhas and a kuan-yin gifted to me so it's not my fault!

    Tairin - I know you feel. I was just thinking how I'd like to get a more Japanese style buddha statue and a mokugyo actually looks beautiful and it's a useful tool. So I don't have a lot but it would be cool. hahahah

    Gassho

    Risho
    -stlah

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Risho View Post


    I have a few buddhas and a kuan-yin gifted to me so it's not my fault!

    Tairin - I know you feel. I was just thinking how I'd like to get a more Japanese style buddha statue and a mokugyo actually looks beautiful and it's a useful tool. So I don't have a lot but it would be cool. hahahah

    Gassho

    Risho
    -stlah
    I use the mokugyo daily. I find it useful for chanting

    SatToday
    Bion
    美音

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  18. #18
    Member Yuki's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bion View Post
    I use the mokugyo daily. I find it useful for chanting

    SatToday
    We are using it often too in Chanting and Zazen Circle, mostly with Hannya Shingyo and HAKUIN ZENJI ZAZEN WASAN, and sometimes with Enmei Juku Kannon Gyo.

    Yuki (雪)
    Sat today

  19. #19

    Do We Need A Mokuhyo (or Moktak)

    Quote Originally Posted by Yuki View Post
    We are using it often too in Chanting and Zazen Circle, mostly with Hannya Shingyo and HAKUIN ZENJI ZAZEN WASAN, and sometimes with Enmei Juku Kannon Gyo.

    Yuki (雪)
    Sat today
    You put it to good use and keep it busy!

    SatToday
    Bion
    美音

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    Join me on Insight Timer
    Help me feed those in need by joining my Share The Meal team HERE

  20. #20
    Hi Talib! Good to see you back here! You and I joined Treeleaf around the same time.

    Gassho,
    Jakuden
    SatToday
    清 道 寂田
    SEIDO JAKUDEN
    She/her.
    I am a novice priest. Any resemblance my posts may have to actual teachings about the Dharma, living or dead, is purely coincidental (and just my attempt to be helpful).

  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Jundo View Post
    Our Zendo and my house are filled with little Buddha statues, bells, incense burners and other stuff ... mokugyo too.
    I very rarely see Gautama Buddha figures about. I often see bodhisattvas and laughing buddha. I have been on the look out for a nice Gautama buddha statue!

    There is a fine balance I go for, I look out for but I don't seek. If I see things I want i think my karma has ripened, and if the price is right I'll get it. Otherwise maybe I need to do more metta, get my karma back in align. I don't cling to these desires. Besides I like to keep my possessions pretty minimal.

    Here in Ishikawa Bodhidharma daruma dolls are everywhere though.
    Last edited by WanderingIntrospection; 10-04-2021 at 06:09 AM.
    "We may hear and understand as well, yet in our daily lives still be subject to our habitual ways. And so we do zazen to cut all of this habitualization away. If we don’t cut, we end up carrying more and more burdens around."
    Finding Our Essence of Mind

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by WanderingIntrospection View Post
    I very rarely see Gautama Buddha figures about. I often see bodhisattvas and laughing buddha. I have been on the look out for a nice Gautama buddha statue!

    There is a fine balance I go for, I look out for but I don't seek. If I see things I want i think my karma has ripened, and if the price is right I'll get it. Otherwise maybe I need to do more metta, get my karma back in align. I don't cling to these desires. Besides I like to keep my possessions pretty minimal.

    Here in Ishikawa Bodhidharma daruma dolls are everywhere though.
    Most seated Buddhas I see are actually Amida Buddha, which one can generally tell from the Zazen mudra in which the hands, with backs of the fingers are touching, is a bit different from our Zazen mudra which is what Shakyamuni uses generally.


    But it is fine. Our Buddha in the Tsukuba Zendo may actually have originally been Amida, but I cannot tell because the body is so beat up and worn away. Buddha is a Buddha is a Buddha ...

    Gassho, J

    STLah
    ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Risho View Post
    I wonder if the Motak is more tender than the Mokugyo. I mean I soaked that think in salt water for hours, and it's still pretty tough to chew. Definitely not my favorite fish; I'd go with Salmon.

    Happy Thursday

    Gassho

    Risho
    -stlah


    Gassho,
    Seibu
    Will sit right away/lah

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