Results 1 to 22 of 22

Thread: For Discussion: Separating Ango and Jukai

  1. #1

    For Discussion: Separating Ango and Jukai

    Dear All,

    I have a question for our members, particularly those folks who have participated in Ango and Jukai in past years.

    We are thinking of trying an experiment this year to separate the times for our Treeleaf Ango (90 Day Special Practice Period) and Jukai (Undertaking the Precepts Preparations and Ceremony). Maybe doing both at the same time, as we have for the last dozen years, is a little too much at once for some people, and we should schedule them for different seasons.

    Jukai preparations presently consist of weekly Precepts readings and discussions and sewing a Rakusu, beginning in September, and closing with our two day Rohatsu Retreat in early December, and a Jukai Ceremony in January. We could keep that schedule this year, or move Jukai to commence in January and end with a Ceremony in April.

    Ango encourages a variety of activities, including additional sitting and other practices ...

    https://www.treeleaf.org/forums/show...0-Days%29-2019

    We could keep Ango during the period of early September through early December, or move it to the Spring from April through July.

    Any feelings on this? Should we just keep things as they have been? If we do separate Jukai preparations and Ango, what months are best for each?

    Thank you for your input and help.

    Gassho, Jundo

    STLah
    ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

  2. #2
    I love fall Ango and the way it rolls into Rohatsu with a roar but will be happy to participate in whatever is decided. _()_

    gassho

    shonin sat today/lah
    Visiting unsui: salt liberally.

  3. #3
    I found it a very wonderful experience and a great final of the ango to celebrate jukai. It's just my personal opinion but I think it's a very nice way. But anyway, changing something and check out how it works is a fair thing


    Gassho

    Ben


    Stlah

    Enviado desde mi PLK-L01 mediante Tapatalk

  4. #4
    Member Onka's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Location
    Rural Queensland, so-called Australia
    I found that the discipline of Ango set me up nicely for Jukai study. I would though, like last year, put a pause on book club reading so that Jukai students can focus on their studies exclusively.
    In saying the above I can only guess at the workload that it takes Priests and Unsui in preparing and running Ango and Jukai back to back so think this should be a consideration.
    Gassho
    Onka
    st

    Sent from my SM-A205YN using Tapatalk
    穏 On (Calm)
    火 Ka (Fires)
    They/She.

  5. #5
    Personally I found it very rewarding to participate in Ango while undergoing the Jukai preparations (reading and seeing). It felt very natural to me. I can certainly understand how some might feel overwhelmed.

    I agree with Shonin that Ango leading into Rohatsu makes a lot of sense.


    Tairin
    Sat today and lah

  6. #6
    I also think that Ango leading up to Jukai and Rohatsu works as a natural kind of progression. But I can also understand how people with more busy and demanding lives could want to separate it.

    Gassho
    STlah
    James

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Shoki View Post
    I also think that Ango leading up to Jukai and Rohatsu works as a natural kind of progression. But I can also understand how people with more busy and demanding lives could want to separate it.

    Gassho
    STlah
    James
    Yes this is much how I feel too and I don't remember it being so challenging, but accept that others with more commitments might.
    I would add that I believe it's really important for all of us to revisit the Precepts and the points of the Eightfold Noble Path at least once a year.
    Gassho
    Meitou
    Sattoday lah
    命 Mei - life
    島 Tou - island

  8. #8
    Hello,
    myself, I benefit from intellectual studies, being accompanied with practice.
    Reflecting and experiencing in balance.
    With the intensified studying during Jukai preparations, IMHO there has to be intensified practice (at least some elements of Ango), too.
    But I am viewing this from a perspective of a not too busy life with some time available.

    Gassho,
    Kotei sat/lah today.

    義道 冴庭 / Gidō Kotei.
    Being a novice priest doesn't mean my writing about the Dharma is more substantial than yours. Actually, it might well be the other way round.

  9. #9
    I think that the separation makes a lot of sense. It's not always easy to have enough time to have practice that intensive. And I say this as someone planning to participate in jukai this year.

    Gassho,

    Kirk

    sat
    流文

    I know nothing.

  10. #10
    For what it's worth, I am looking forward to participating in both Ango and Jukai this year, and I'm fine with either approach. They do seem like they would complement each other well as parts of a single intense practice period, but if separating them would make it easier for more folks to participate, then that certainly has merit too. I'm happy to participate either way.

    Gassho,
    Rob

    st


    Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
    聖簡 Seikan (Sacred Simplicity)

  11. #11
    I can see the arguments on both sides. I plan on participating in both Jukai and Ango this year and will be happy with whatever decision is made. If I had to state a preference, I would say I like the idea of separating them, because both are intensive, and that would give us two intensive practice periods per year. But I want to let go of my preferences, so whatever happens is fine.

    Gassho,
    Juki
    sat today and lah
    "First you have to give up." Tyler Durden

  12. #12
    I am looking forward to jukai and have been anxious for it to get here, I look forward to hearing what others think especially the ones that have gone through both at the same time. I am fine with any of it and if I really had to choose anything it would be that Jukai stay the same.


    Gassho
    John
    SatToday
    Heitou
    平桃

  13. #13
    Member Yokai's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
    Location
    Havelock North, Hawkes Bay, New Zealand
    Treeleaf is so wonderfully accommodating of family/work, I will be honoured to share this first Ango & Jukai with you whatever is decided.
    Deep bows Jundo and all for shaping this inclusive, flexible and committed community

    Gassho, Chris satlah

  14. #14
    Thank you, Jundo, for putting this up for discussion. I would find it easier to do both ango and a review of the precepts if they were at different times.

    Gassho,
    Onkai
    Sat/LAH
    美道 Bidou Beautiful Way
    恩海 Onkai Merciful/Kind Ocean

    I have a lot to learn; take anything I say that sounds like teaching with a grain of salt.

  15. #15
    For me, autumn and ango have become one and the same. I wouldn't want to move it. As for Jukai prep, I don't know. I've had more than one practice partner struggle to keep up and/or drop out, so I could see the argument for separating the two.

    Gassho

    Nenka
    ST

  16. #16
    Hi all,
    Having participated in a grand total of one Ango (and I didn’t participate in Jukai because I felt too new at practice), ha, I’ll say that it felt natural to make a deeper dive into practice prior to Jukai. I can see how both might be difficult for both participants and priests though. It might be interesting and beneficial to have two separate periods of intense focus and commitment. I’m looking forward to participating either way you decide!
    Gassho,
    Krista
    st

  17. #17
    I share the view of those who enjoyed Ango including and culminating with Jukai; I felt beginning the new year and concluding Ango with Jukai made for a very special experience.

    Gassho
    Kyōsen
    Sat|LAH
    橋川
    kyō (bridge) | sen (river)

  18. #18
    Hi Jundo,

    Over the years having Ango and Jukai together have become a nice tradition. Although I see the point in have them both separated, I guess they compliment each other. I would keep them as they are, but I also have no problem in participating in the 2 events.

    Gassho,

    Kyonin
    Sat/LAH
    Hondō Kyōnin
    奔道 協忍

  19. #19
    Looks like the consensus among opinions expressed is that many people seem to appreciate having this together, and nobody feels very very strongly that they are best separated.

    So, as the tradition works, no need to change it! Thanks to all of you.

    Let's look forward to Ango - Jukai season 2020, starting in early September. Details in the coming weeks.

    Gassho, Jundo

    STLah
    ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

  20. #20
    I can't wait, Thank You Jundo

    Gassho
    John
    SatToday
    Heitou
    平桃

  21. #21
    Late to the party as ever but I also really got a lot from the period of ango culminating in jukai too. I don't have much spare time but it didn't feel like too much to me.

    Gassho

    Heiso
    StLah

    Sent from my E5823 using Tapatalk

  22. #22
    I “flunked” out of Jukai last year mostly due to culminating grad studies and newborn and frankly just not feeling sincerely ready yet. It may have been more doable with Ango and Jukai separated, but the extra effort is a good filter and they fit together nicely.

    Gassho
    Kevin
    ST


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •