[Engaged] Engaged Practice: I agree....Whats Next?

Please see this post from Jundo, as a preface to this conversation and action.

From the letter:

Quote:

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As people of faith and conscience, we feel that it is important that we speak out clearly in defense of basic human rights at this time, calling for an immediate end to this heartless practice. In doing so, we join the voices of many religious leaders and congregations that have unreservedly condemned this policy of separation. This policy is a serious violation of the rights of the child and must be stopped today.

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I have a love hate relationship with open letters calling for action. I love the fact that they often open our eyes to something, they allow us to take a stand with many others and add our name to the list. Hopefully the letter and list will go somewhere and someone will believe that if 200 or more people have signed it then it must be important and we should take note.

But what I hate is they get circulated around the internet but there often isn’t a clear path of what will happen next or steps people who agree with the letter should take.

So I’m opening the discussion… if you agree with the letter; then what’s next? What steps will you take?

Gassho,

Shoka
sattoday

Thank you Shoka.

For those of us in the United States: please PLEASE call, fax, or email your senators and tell them to encourage the President to stop this policy of separating children from their families. If you can go in person and talk to someone in your Senator's office, that would be even better!

If you do not currently know who your senator is, here is how to find out:
https://www.senate.gov/general/conta...nators_cfm.cfm

If your senator is on the Judiciary Committee - consider encouraging them to vote for the "Keep Families Together Act" (which is currently stuck in the Judiciary Committee):
https://www.feinstein.senate.gov/pub...grant-families

For a list of Republican Senators on Judiciary Committee see:
https://www.judiciary.senate.gov/about/members

- Chuck Grassley - IA
- Orrin Hatch - UT
- Lindsey Graham - SC
- John Cornyn - TX
- Michael Lee - UT
- Ted Cruz - TX
- Ben Sasse - NE
- Jeff Flake - AZ
- Mike Crapo - ID
- Thom Tillis - NC
- John Kennedy - LA

For a long list of resources and groups attempting to help, please see this post:
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/...he-border.html

Finally, keep an eye on "Families Belong Together" who organized marches last week (and hopefully will again in the near future):
https://www.familiesbelongtogether.org/

Gassho,
Sekishi
#sat

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sekishi

Thank you Shoka.

For those of us in the United States: please PLEASE call, fax, or email your senators and tell them to encourage the President to stop this policy of separating children from their families. If you can go in person and talk to someone in your Senator's office, that would be even better!

If you do not currently know who your senator is, here is how to find out:
https://www.senate.gov/general/conta...nators_cfm.cfm

If your senator is on the Judiciary Committee - consider encouraging them to vote for the "Keep Families Together Act" (which is currently stuck in the Judiciary Committee):
https://www.feinstein.senate.gov/pub...grant-families

For a list of Republican Senators on Judiciary Committee see:
https://www.judiciary.senate.gov/about/members

- Chuck Grassley - IA
- Orrin Hatch - UT
- Lindsey Graham - SC
- John Cornyn - TX
- Michael Lee - UT
- Ted Cruz - TX
- Ben Sasse - NE
- Jeff Flake - AZ
- Mike Crapo - ID
- Thom Tillis - NC
- John Kennedy - LA

For a long list of resources and groups attempting to help, please see this post:
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/...he-border.html

Finally, keep an eye on "Families Belong Together" who organized marches last week (and hopefully will again in the near future):
https://www.familiesbelongtogether.org/

Gassho,
Sekishi
#sat

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I agree with all of the above. I was emailing today and was really surprised that, as far as I can tell, every legislator uses forms for email. You can't just get their email address. The best site I found for contacting legislators was this one. Provides both your representative in the House and Senate.

https://www.contactingcongress.org/

the nice thing is that it also automatically provides links to their twitter and facebook feeds.

Gassho, Shinshi

SaT-LaH

If you would like to sign a public petition accompanying this Letter, please do so here:

https://chn.ge/2JP3XHy

Thank you.

Gassho, Jundo

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jundo

If you would like to sign a public petition accompanying this Letter, please do so here:

https://chn.ge/2JP3XHy

Thank you.

Gassho, Jundo

---

Thank you Jundo, I have signed it.

Gassho
Shingen

Thank you for these posts and "call to action" -- taking action on these things tonight in my neighborhood circles.

gassho
kim

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jundo

If you would like to sign a public petition accompanying this Letter, please do so here:

https://chn.ge/2JP3XHy

Thank you.

Gassho, Jundo

---

Also signed.

Gassho, Shinshi

SaT-LaH

Signed and donated.
Dave _/\_ SAT LAH

Hi everyone,

So the current action I'm taking is educating myself. As is typical with hot topics there are so many news stories flying around and not everything is the most reliable. In reading several articles, I found out that the children in these cases aren't provided with a lawyers. Which for me seems like a huge problem.

Imagine being a child in a foreign country and being on your own. I remember getting lost in a store when I was like 8 or so, and I was terrified. I was only loss for a few minutes, but it was horrifying. After that my mom talked with all us kids about what to do if we were lost. But I can't imagine trying to figure out what was going on or what to do in a court or detention system.

There are many organizations which are providing free support for the children.

Some of them are below:

RAICES: This Texas-based organization offers free and low-cost legal services to immigrant children and families.

Pueblo Sin Fronteras: This organization provides humanitarian aid and shelter to migrants on their way to the U.S.

Together Rising: This Virginia-based organization is helping provide legal assistance for 60 migrant children who were separated from their parents and are currently detained in Arizona.

Al Otro Lado: This bi-national organization works providing legal services to deportees and migrants in Tijuana, Mexico, including deportee parents whose children remain in the U.S.

The Florence Project: This Arizona-based organization offers free legal services to men, women, and unaccompanied children in immigration custody.

Texas Civil Rights Project: This organization has been using legal advocacy and litigation to help families separated at the border.

Border Angels: This California-based organization supports San Diego County's immigrant population and focuses on issues related to the U.S.-Mexico border.


Visibility and Amplification are also very important in causes like this. Looking around it seems that the major protests occurred last Friday, but I would venture to guess that if the issue isn't resolved soon there will be more. Signing petitions and spreading the word will help to keep the pressure up as well.

Thanks to others who are sharing ideas of what to do.

Gassho,

Shoka
sattoday

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jundo

If you would like to sign a public petition accompanying this Letter, please do so here:

https://chn.ge/2JP3XHy

Thank you.

Gassho, Jundo

---

Signed. I also attempted to write the Republican Senator in my state but received an error message his website is down for maintenance. I will try again later. The democratic senator in my state already seems to be on it.


Sat2day

As more info comes in here, I am sharing the info to my local circles of Buddhists and interfaith activist communities. They in turn are sharing it as well.

No personal or identifying information from TreeLeaf is being posted with this info -- just the info (links and instructions) itself.

Thank you for all you (plural) are doing, and for making this possible.

Gassho rei
Kim
St lh

Sent from my SM-G930U using Tapatalk

Hi all,

Thanks to Sekishi for the great post on government action that can be taken. I had the great pleasure of meeting with some political leaders and there was one really valuable bit of information I walked away with.... when people call, wrote or show up to talk about something they taken it seriously. Of the thousands of people they represent even few take the time, so when people do they listen.

Also here is another petition which you could consider signing:

https://www.change.org/p/department-...families-apart

Gassho,

Shoka
sattoday


Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk

Hi guys,


I'm finding this so overwhelming. I feel so powerless and frustrated!

Gassho

Hoseki
Sattoday

Michael Avenatti is putting the word out that he wants to represent parents and children who have been separated at the border (Stormy Daniels ‘ lawyer) You can find him on Twitter.

Thanks for getting this going Shoka, I too have signed some online petitions but I will look into contacting senators as well.
Gassho
Jakuden
SatToday/LAH


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hoseki

Hi guys,


I'm finding this so overwhelming. I feel so powerless and frustrated!

Gassho

Hoseki
Sattoday

---

Me too. I just read that the US is pulling out of the UN Human Rights Council. The amount of trauma those kids will have is heartbreaking. I'm going to see if there are any petitions to ask UK politicians/PM to put pressure on Trump by publically condemning his actions. Maybe if we can channel the pressure through political channels it could have an impact...but he does seem to be digging his heals in.

Gassho
Eishuu
ST/LAH

https://www.facebook.com/donate/490507544717085/

https://www.raicestexas.org/#donate

Info here:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/e...JsKjc_IaYQ/pub

This organization, RAICES, is garnering huge support for legal representation, counseling, etc. for these families! The website I think has crashed from the traffic but you can donate through the facebook page!

Gassho,
Jakuden
SatToday/LAH

Well, it looks like all the petitions and phone calls from Treeleafers worked! :-) In fact, in the wide and interconnected world, all the little drops of water coming together make an ocean current. Thank you to all who took some steps.

It worked, but only a little and only for now. Of course, none of this solves the many many problems faced by refugees at the US border or worldwide, nor of the societies that need to figure out how best to respond. These separated families were just the surface eruption, not the underlying and chronic disease which must be addressed. Our responsibility, as individuals and as members of groups ... and as Buddhists ... continues.

There are humane, effective and rational systems which can be developed to deal with this better, admitting those who would add and contribute to our societies We Americans (even the native Americans at some point in the past) are all the children of immigrants ourselves.

Gassho, J

SatTodayLAH

Hi all,

I think this is a great reminder that as Jundo said, "all the little drops of water coming together make an ocean current."

In less than 24 hours the current completely changed. It is amazing to see that.

For those who were able to take some action thank you, every drop matters. For those who felt like they couldn't do anything, please know that lending support and encouragement to those who are affected or taking action is help and taking action.

Thanks to everyone who took sometime to look into this problem, engage with it, and take some action.

Gassho,

Shoka
sattoday

Hey folks,

Yes this is wonderful news that Trump has changed his stance (even though he was the one who started it), but sadly his actions have had and will have a ripple effect. Listening to the news this morning there is little hope that the children affected will be connected back to their parents (as most of them will or have already been deported). Most if not all the children do not speak English and nor do they have a strong grasp (due to their age and language gap) to tell someone the identifying characteristics of their parents.

It is wonderful to see how the world came together in support and changed happened. However, this should have never happened in the first place ... it is very sad.

Gassho
Shingen

Sat/LAH

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Shingen

... Listening to the news this morning there is little hope that the children affected will be connected back to their parents (as most of them will or have already been deported). Most if not all the children do not speak English and nor do they have a strong grasp (due to their age and language gap) to tell someone the identifying characteristics of their parents.

---

Is this true? That can't be. I have trouble to believe this even in this mess. Where did you read this?

I am sure that this will become clear in the coming days as to whether it is true or not.

Gassho, J

SatTodayLAH

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jundo

Is this true? That can't be. I have trouble to believe this even in this mess. Where did you read this?

I am sure that this will become clear in the coming days as to whether it is true or not.

Gassho, J

SatTodayLAH

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Yes, I heard it today both on the CBC radio programs "On the Island" and "The Current". I will keep looking for the transcripts for "On The Island", but here is the one for "The Current" (https://www.cbc.ca/radio/thecurrent/...ript-1.4716032).

Yes, things will in time become more clear, but this is still a huge issue. One immigration lawyer was very concerned with this, but we will have to see how things unfold in the coming days and weeks.

I myself hope this is not the case ... but it is a very worrying position.

Gassho
Shingen

Sat/LAH

They are shipping these children all over. A group of young boys were seen and photographed at LaGuardia airport in NY, in the dark. A couple of major airlines have declared they will not transport them, but some have already gone and it may take time to implement. I believe Delta will still fly them. No doubt it’s going to be impossible to get all these kids and parents back together.

Gassho
Jakuden
SatToday/LAH


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It is also worth noting that Wednesday was the International Day of the Refugee. It is said that there are 69 million displaced persons worldwide.

https://www.awarenessdays.com/awaren...ugee-day-2018/

The following is offered as "citizen (and an immigrant myself)" not "Zen teacher" ...

Politics is preventing us from establishing rational, effective systems to deal with the problems of refugees and illegal immigration. I very much believe (being raised in Miami, a city of refugees from the Caribbean and elsewhere) that most people wish to come, work hard and have a good life. They aid the economy, they often do the jobs that others are unwilling to do. The vast, vast majority live peacefully, work hard and contribute to the economy and society. Such people should be welcomed, as my own ancestors were welcomed (and I am welcomed as a foreigner in Japan).

However, in return such people must be honest and work hard. Any arrest and conviction for a felony, especially a violent felony, should mean immediate and final deportation after punishment, one strike and you are out. (I just read that, despite claims otherwise from the White House, the crime rate in Germany is the lowest in decades despite high immigration rates: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...ner-question-2 ) They must actively work or seek work, and not merely collect social services without such effort or other extenuating circumstances. They must attempt to learn the local language and abide by local customs (while the surrounding society also recognizes and honors freedom of religion and cherishes some cultural diversity).

At the border, there should be stations to welcome certain types of individuals: People who pass a health test, demonstrate a physical ability to work, provide some evidence of refugee status if applying as a refugee (that they are fleeing legitimate violence), and can show someone in the welcoming country willing to sponsor them (a family member or potential employer seeking workers). They would be issued an identity card which they must always carry, and which must be shown to receive social services or upon police request together with proof of current employment or active seeking of work via employment offices (In Japan, I must comply as a foreigner and non-refugee alien with all of these requirements). With modern technology, place a locator chip in the card so that their location can be established (they are guests in the country, not citizens, so civil rights are more limited), and if they are ever found to not be carrying the card then they are subject to detention. Allow a path to citizenship or permanent residence after 10 years of clean living in the country. Set a high quota each year for number of people admitted, and establish procedures in the home countries for people to meet these tests legally before they must make the terrible journeys at the hands of bandits and smugglers.

Others who fail to comply with these standards would not not be admitted or will be deported when found.

It is really not so complicated. It is not perfect, and also (and unavoidably) harsh in aspects, but better than the present situation.

Furthermore, we must do all we can to improve the situation, economically and through other assistance, in countries of origin.

Most refugees and other immigrants eventually blend in to the local culture, by the way, especially those raised there from childhood. The numbers coming to Europe and the US seem very large but are actually a small percentage compared to the native population and not that much more than immigration rates in prior generations. People of the past were also quite mobile and fluid. In America, hard to find many people all of whose ancestors were there 150 years ago.

That is my too simple, too imperfect plan. However, I am not a politician.

Peace, Jundo (citizen and immigrant to another country, not Zen teacher, on this issue)

SatTodayLAH

What you have written here is pretty much exactly what my grandparents had to go through on Ellis Island! My grandfather was 15 and came over alone. Applied and was approved for citizenship some years later.

Gassho
Jakuden
SatToday/LAH


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Shingen

Yes, I heard it today both on the CBC radio programs "On the Island" and "The Current". I will keep looking for the transcripts for "On The Island", but here is the one for "The Current" (https://www.cbc.ca/radio/thecurrent/...ript-1.4716032).

Yes, things will in time become more clear, but this is still a huge issue. One immigration lawyer was very concerned with this, but we will have to see how things unfold in the coming days and weeks.

I myself hope this is not the case ... but it is a very worrying position.

Gassho
Shingen

Sat/LAH

---

Well, yep, the situation seems to be chaos on reuniting the existing parents and children. Hopefully, this will be quickly remedied.

https://us.cnn.com/videos/politics/2...logue-ebof.cnn

I also wonder with some puzzlement at this coat (true story) that Mrs. Trump wore today to visit the children and afterward, a very strange choice. Very strange:

https://us.cnn.com/2018/06/21/politi...ket/index.html

https://cdn.cnn.com/cnnnext/dam/asse...xlarge-169.jpg

Gassho, J

SatTodayLAH

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jundo

Well, yep, the situation seems to be chaos on reuniting the existing parents and children. Hopefully, this will be quickly remedied.

---

Unfortunately what I’ve been reading from activist groups since last week it seems pretty clear that either planning for eventual re-uniting or families was poor, or willfully omitted.

I’ve tried to remain optimistic, but we are seeing this echoed now by mainstream media sources. Some children may never be reunited with their families. It is infuriating and heartbreaking.

I will be out on the streets on June 30. Maybe sooner too.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jundo

https://cdn.cnn.com/cnnnext/dam/asse...xlarge-169.jpg

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Time to make a shirt that says simply “I do care.”

Deep bows and some tears,
Sekishi
#sat



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Hello all,

The political climate in the United States has made me do much reanalyzing lately. I have read articles and listened to individuals on both sides of the spectrum and have come to one conclusion.

Each side feel they are doing the correct thing. This feeling is backed by the ideals and ideas that are heavily ingrained in them by the media they consume, the people they interact with, and their childhood.

From this side the policies enacted against illegal immigrants seems cruel and unjustified. However, people who lean toward the conservative side see the policies as necessary to protect their lifestyles and those they care about.

Please remember that all people are victims of delusion and the monster humanity created called politics. All these political issues can be studied from hundreds of vantage points and each one leads to a solution. However, everything is a trade off. There is no solution that will make everyone happy.

James F
Sat

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

Michael Avenatti is trying to get the hashtag "#singlestagingareanow" trending on Twitter, urging to reunite the families and children in a single area like a stadium before the problem gets worse. Just go to twitter and retweet the hashtag.

Gassho,
Jakuden
SatToday/LAH

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jundo

Is this true? That can't be. I have trouble to believe this even in this mess. Where did you read this?

I am sure that this will become clear in the coming days as to whether it is true or not.

Gassho, J

SatTodayLAH

---

Here is just another example of what I also heard and shared. This is horrible to hear and even sadder to know that will most likely be the outcome. Please listen from mark 5:50:

https://youtu.be/o1ZfBFyrskY?t=347

Gassho
Shingen

Sat/LAH

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Shingen

Here is just another example of what I also heard and shared. This is horrible to hear and even sadder to know that will most likely be the outcome. Please listen from mark 5:50:

https://youtu.be/o1ZfBFyrskY?t=347

Gassho
Shingen

Sat/LAH

---

This is awful. I think it's interesting that the guy who was interviewed about whether it was inhumane made it very clear that he was 'just doing his job' and took no moral responsibility for his actions. I hope there are ways we can keep up the pressure so that something is put in place to reunite families. I hope the media doesn't go quiet on this now.

Gassho
Eishuu
ST/LAH

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Eishuu

This is awful. I think it's interesting that the guy who was interviewed about whether it was inhumane made it very clear that he was 'just doing his job' and took no moral responsibility for his actions. I hope there are ways we can keep up the pressure so that something is put in place to reunite families. I hope the media doesn't go quiet on this now.

Gassho
Eishuu
ST/LAH

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Thank you Eishuu, I agree. Pressure and not allowing it to fall away is an important action to help everyone get united.

Gassho
Shingen

Sat/LAH

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Eishuu

This is awful. I think it's interesting that the guy who was interviewed about whether it was inhumane made it very clear that he was 'just doing his job' and took no moral responsibility for his actions. I hope there are ways we can keep up the pressure so that something is put in place to reunite families. I hope the media doesn't go quiet on this now.

Gassho
Eishuu
ST/LAH

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Yes, it is awful. I keep thinking this is a nightmare and we are all going to wake up and realize it didn't really happen =( But, sadly, it did and my biggest concern is also that media is going to go on to the next thing, and like a herd of sheep, people will follow and this will get forgotten about.

Gassho,
Joyo
sat today/lah

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Joyo

Yes, it is awful. I keep thinking this is a nightmare and we are all going to wake up and realize it didn't really happen =( But, sadly, it did and my biggest concern is also that media is going to go on to the next thing, and like a herd of sheep, people will follow and this will get forgotten about.

Gassho,
Joyo
sat today/lah

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I already read in one of the big UK papers this morning that they were stopping their coverage (obviously they think the story is over). I found this article from 5 days ago with a list of advocacy organisations, most of which offer legal support to immigrants. Obviously it's a bit out of date now but the list of organisations might be useful. I think it's a lot of the same ones you mention, Shoka, but there are links to donate and links to the websites https://www.refinery29.com/2018/06/2...parated-border

Also Alyssa Milano has just offered to foster an immigrant child and support them through the process of being reunited with parents. At least this kind of action might keep it in the news.

Gassho
Eishuu
ST/LAH

There’s still coverage going on here, CNN has a big story about the issue of getting these children reunited with their parents. It’s inevitable that coverage will fade, though. Poor Puerto Rico got wiped off the map and everyone forgot.
Gassho
Jakuden
SatToday/LAH


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If you live in the San Francisco Bay Area, you may be interested in participating in this.

On Saturday July 7th, Green Gulch Sangha (part of San Francisco Zen Center) will be sitting zazen as a vigil at the Richmond ICE detention center. More info: http://blogs.sfzc.org/blog/2018/06/2...h-hosts-vigil/

Saturday, July 7
West County Detention Facility, 5555 Giant Hwy, Richmond, CA 94806
9:30 am – 10:30 am — Zazen
11 am – noon — Ceremonies, Teachings, and Testimonials

I plan on attending.

Gassho.

My son and I went to the #FamiliesBelongTogetherMarch in front of our congressman's office today. We considered going to one of the large marches in Richmond or DC, but opted instead for something closer to home where it would be very difficult to be dismissed as "paid protesters" or "fake news".

I was not sure what to expect in a sleepy little town in rural Virginia, but was pleasantly surprised that 50 or 60 people showed up to sing, laugh, chant, and wave signs and flags in the 94F (34C) sun. A few people who were not able to "march" for medical reasons stopped by with ice, water, and to support others.

Response from passers-by was mostly positive; a few hundred honks and cheers of support, maybe a dozen negative shouts, one "coal rolling" truck smoked the crowd, and and one guy doubled back through town a few times to make rude hand-gestures from his Harley.

On the way home my son was positively beaming. While at the march, everyone we met was smiling. There is a teaching in that I think. *It feels good to do good.* It might be scary and your voice might shake, but when you take action in the world with the intention of helping others: you'll feel good.

My son wants to do more. He has already signed up to help out in our local community in some other ways. And I think there is a teaching in that too. Sometimes we read about events that break our hearts and we do not see a way that we can help. *Every harmless and beneficial action is worth taking.* When the heart calls for action -- take action, even if it does not directly help with the issue that awakened the heart original. Sometimes we hear of a terrible tragedy that happens on the other side of the world and it seems there is little we can do to help those affected. The desire to help is our Bodhisattva nature, and we should listen to it and nurture it however we can. Help one being to help all beings.

At least thats how I see it this evening.

Deep bows,
Sekishi

#sat #lah

Attachment 5150

That is awesome Sekishi. Thank you so much for sharing.

Gassho, Shinshi

SaT-LaH

Nice work Sekishi and son. =)

Gassho
Shingen

Sat/LAH

My daughter and I attended a local march here in California today. We also skipped the big rallies in San Francisco and Oakland, opting for a local rally in Concord, CA. It was hot, but there were over 1,000 people in attendance. Lots of organizers and politicians gave speeches and it was a super energetic crowd. My daughter was absolutely thrilled to see so many people who cared about this issue as much as she does.

Quote:

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On the way home my son was positively beaming. While at the march, everyone we met was smiling. There is a teaching in that I think. *It feels good to do good.*

---

Same. My daughter just could not stop smiling all the way home on BART. It was so encouraging for me, as it's been a tough week of news for this country.

Attachment 5151

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Todd

My daughter and I attended a local march here in California today. We also skipped the big rallies in San Francisco and Oakland, opting for a local rally in Concord, CA. It was hot, but there were over 1,000 people in attendance. Lots of organizers and politicians gave speeches and it was a super energetic crowd. My daughter was absolutely thrilled to see so many people who cared about this issue as much as she does.



Same. My daughter just could not stop smiling all the way home on BART. It was so encouraging for me, as it's been a tough week of news for this country.

Attachment 5151

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Her smile is contagious indeed. What a wonderful experience to share with your daughter :)


Sat2day

Well done, you guys. <3

Gassho, sat today, lah

I am going to place these links here to a recent trilogy by a respected podcast from the US public radio show, "Radiolab." It is stunning, it is heartbreaking. Most importantly, it expresses how complicated these issues are, without simple right or wrong answers sometimes.

Yes, I feel that separating family, parents and small children, is so clearly wrong that it needed to be protested and stopped. However, the question of illegal immigration itself, and how to deal with it, is the bigger question with no easy answers. This program explains why. The bottom line is the preservation of life, as our Precepts guide us to seek. This program describes tens of thousands of deaths due to a combination of (1) desperate people, mostly for economic reasons although some to escape gang violence and persecution, willing to do almost anything for a chance at a better life, combined with (2) government border policies that were so effective at the "easier" (none are easy) crossing points, thus forcing people to walk through the deserts and mountains, a trip many do not survive. The policies have also increased the role of "coyote" smugglers, who often physically abuse the people they are leading. What happened is that tightening restrictions caused people to come the hardest ways. I will be frank, it almost (emphasis on almost!) made me think at one point "the Wall might not be a bad idea if it completely stops crossing all along the border (it would not, as the show makes clear) because then we could replace this madness with a rational system of admission that would save lives."

I suppose my point is that easing or tightening enforcement and restrictions in one way has effects, many unexpected and life threatening, in other sometimes unseen ways. Great caution is required.

For that reason, opinions can vary among good Buddhists. I do not think that we can say the the Precepts and Compassion lead us particularly to x or y policy stance on this question. While I believe that separating children and parents is wrong, I also believe that a radical reformation of this system is required. I believe that these poor people should not be subject to violence and economic injustice back home. I believe that as many good people as possible should be given a chance to contribute to American (and, where similar situations exist, European and Japanese) society. Policies need to be developed which bring order to the system, while not encouraging people to make these horrible and life threatening treks. I am not sure what those policies are, and hope our supposed "leaders" of both parties put the politics aside and develop some workable policies. Thus, I am not willing to officially say at this point that "Buddhists" or "our Sangha" must believe x or y about immigration policy apart from the most basic stance that (1) separating families is wrong, (2) we must do all we can to preserve life, (3) we must continue to work for a world where so many people do not have to live in economic deprivation and subject to violence, (4) there must be developed some rational policy to thread this needle by our leaders. For example, I have recently heard the voices of good and caring Buddhists, some living near border areas such as California, Arizona, New Mexico and Texas, who say that things are not so simple.

You can listen online or download as an MP3. Be warned that some of the descriptions, including of the biology of death in the desert and what happens to corpses to cause them to almost vanish, as well as sexual assaults, may be difficult for sensitive listeners.

Border Trilogy Part 1: Hole in the Fence
https://www.wnycstudios.org/story/border-trilogy-part-1

Border Trilogy Part 2: Hold the Line
https://www.wnycstudios.org/story/bo...rt-2-hold-line

Border Trilogy Part 3: What Remains
https://www.wnycstudios.org/story/bo...3-what-remains

Personally, I would like to find a way to stop people crossing through the desert and dying, while bringing them some relief in their home countries from poverty and violence, combined with a rational system of admissions. European, Japanese and American workers worried about their own jobs and wages in the face of competition also must be listened to, as well as economists who speak of the mixed positive and negative effects of immigration on domestic economies. Right now, doing all that seems almost impossible. It almost seems that we must pick among priorities.

I will say that in the Buddha's day, there were also terrible cases of famine and war, mass migrations and kingdoms which built walls and castles to protect their territories. I don't believe that the Buddha himself came up with one "Buddhist solution" except to say that this world, Samsara, is a place of suffering beyond fixing. Bodhidharma crossed mountains and seas to come from the west. I still don't know why.

Gassho, J

Gassho Jundo. This like all issues is not black and white but a nice gray. This is a highly complex issue that does not have an easy fix solution.

James F
Sat

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Thank you for posting these Jundo.

Yesterday I avoided a confrontational discussion with my wife’s opinionated uncle on this topic. We were talking about something else and the topic of separating parents from children at the border came up. I was told “you don’t understand the situation”. I was about to respond but then decided better of it. Surprisingly he also let it go.

I do believe that no matter the reason it is wrong to separate the children from their parents. Even if some kids are being used by drug traffickers or whatever this is a case where you error on the side of keeping families together BUT I do recognize that this a complicated issue with lots of grey.

I’ll take some time to educate myself more on this issue

gassho2
Tairin
Sat today.

Thank you Jundo for your teachings. I found that post really insightful and I appreciate the links.

Not only are the problems incredibly complex - our current political landscape seems to be such that issues are only addressed only in the simplest terms. Complex issues are reduced to some meaningless slogan. And then the slogan is used to create policy - completely ignoring the underlying issues.

Gassho, Shinshi

SaT-LaH

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Originally Posted by Jundo

I am going to place these links here to a recent trilogy by a respected podcast from the US public radio show, "Radiolab." It is stunning, it is heartbreaking. Most importantly, it expresses how complicated these issues are, without simple right or wrong answers sometimes.

Yes, I feel that separating family, parents and small children, is so clearly wrong that it needed to be protested and stopped. However, the question of illegal immigration itself, and how to deal with it, is the bigger question with no easy answers.

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Great recommendation Jundo (I never miss a Radiolab - it is one of my favorite podcasts!).

As you allude, the causes of conditions around illegal immigration are boundless - a dense thicket of individual choices and biases, national policies, economics, and politics. Well intentioned people have been trying for reform for years. I have opinions about this grey area, but am also very open to a multitude of views.

Separating children from their parents with no clear plan to re-unite them, and then putting them in kennels or tents: this is a bright line for me. Such a policy is deeply inhumane. I can see no grey area.

At least that is my view.

Deep bows to all,
Sekishi
#sat #lah

Sekishi,

Reading your post made me want to clarify something about an earlier post of mine in this thread. Although the issue of illegal immigration is a massive gray area the option of breaking up families is not in my mind. Separating kids from there parents is cruel and something we has a country should not allow.

Back on the issue of immigration I am afraid our current political environment is not well suited to tackle these complex issues. This is a result of our essentially two party system. We have extremes on either side of the spectrum who take hard stances on almost every topic. How can we work in the gray area when extremes are the only options. Throw in big business meddling and you have our current political environment. Until big business money is taken out of the equation I don't know of there is a fix for it.

James F
Sat

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Reading your post made me want to clarify something about an earlier post of mine in this thread. Although the issue of illegal immigration is a massive gray area the option of breaking up families is not in my mind. Separating kids from there parents is cruel and something we has a country should not allow.

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I'm glad you clarified, because your previous posts felt dangerously close to advocating moral equivalency. I think Buddhism suffers from a particular danger of this, as well as a bias to inaction. It's something I struggle with a lot, particularly when I read something like the poem Faith In Mind. (I also struggle with "turn the other cheek" from my prior religious tradition.) But I simply cannot accept that inaction is an acceptable response.

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Originally Posted by Todd

I'm glad you clarified, because your previous posts felt dangerously close to advocating moral equivalency. I think Buddhism suffers from a particular danger of this, as well as a bias to inaction. It's something I struggle with a lot, particularly when I read something like the poem Faith In Mind. (I also struggle with "turn the other cheek" from my prior religious tradition.) But I simply cannot accept that inaction is an acceptable response.

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Hi Todd,

Most of this is just me playing devils advocate on the topic of immigration. I think a big issue now a days is that with most of our communication being online it is easy to find groups of like minded people. However, doing this creates an echo chamber where different views and ideas are buried. This is where a lot of the political extremism we see today was born and where the issue continues to grow.

Part of my practice that I am working on now is that in the past I have seen things as black and white...right and wrong. I am working to see both sides of issues without preconceptions.

All that being said there are lines that should not be crossed and one of them is purposly separating families with no plans to reunite them.

James F
Sat

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Anka

Reading your post made me want to clarify something about an earlier post of mine in this thread. Although the issue of illegal immigration is a massive gray area the option of breaking up families is not in my mind. Separating kids from there parents is cruel and something we has a country should not allow.

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Hi Anka,

My apologies, I was simply trying to make my position clear (and explain why I felt strongly enough to go out and protest). I was not arguing your point at all.

Deep bows,
Sekishi
#sat #lah



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