Paradoxical Gratitude

[StoBird]

I’m curious about gratitude in Sōtō Zen. From what I understand, gratitude comes in three forms: the first is novel gratitude or being thankful for new things people and experiences, the second is normal gratitude or being thankful for the ordinary things we take for granted, and the third is paradoxical gratitude or finding thankfulness for things we would rather not have in our lives.

The third form of gratitude is the most difficult form of gratitude but it’s the most beneficial, in the bad experiences in life we find something to be grateful for, we find meaning in our suffering and it ceases to be suffering as Victor Frankl would say. Of course all three gratitudes are present in Sōtō zen but correct me if I am wrong but isn’t it with this third form of gratitude where shikantaza and daily Sōtō practice works a great deal of it’s magic? The suffering caused by the gap of what we want through wishful thinking and what our reality is closes because we find meaning (and thus power over suffering) in that each moment is precious and sacred and our suffering becomes non-suffering suffering.

Gassho,
Tom

SatLah

[Tairin]

Hi Tom

You may find the recent podcast by Domyo Burke of interest

https://zenstudiespodcast.com/gratitude-dharma-gate/

gassho2
Tairin
Sat today and lah

[Jundo]

Hi Tom,

I have never heard of those particular categories of gratitude, but it sounds good. Where did you find those?

I feel that you are correct about "paradoxical gratitude" and Shikantaza, except I would call it wise and insightful, not "paradoxical" at all. I wrote the following about it awhile ago ...

SIT-A-LONG with Jundo: gratitude & Great Gratitude


... there is a greater, transcendent, boundless Gratitude in the Buddha's Teachings that does not even need the subtle "see the bright side" "find the positive to counter the negative" or "personal pay-off of what's ultimately nice for 'me'" in the above sense of ordinary gratitude. Rather, there's an even Greater "Non-Pay-off" than that! A Jewel so precious, it shines as both earthly jewels and life's thrown bricks and stones in our shoe. ...

https://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showthread.php?11275-SIT-A-LONG-with-Jundo-gratitude-Great-Gratitude

Gassho, Jundo

STLah

[StoBird]

Yes “paradoxical” gratitude is only paradoxical in that it seems like it shouldn’t be possible to the average non-introspective person.

I got these from a great therapist named Raymond Stafford, a therapist at Nystrom and Associates, LTD who got them from either Dialectical Behavior Therapy (DBT) or the Catholic Benedictine monk David Steindl-Rast, or he made them up himself. Either way, I am grateful for his parsing of gratitude and for the shikantaza that helps me see the “greater, transcendent, boundless Gratitude in the Buddha’s Teachings” that is the paradoxical non-paradoxical wise and insightful Gratitude beyond gratitude.

Gassho,
Tom

Sat/Lah

[StoBird]

Hi Tom

You may find the recent podcast by Domyo Burke of interest

https://zenstudiespodcast.com/gratitude-dharma-gate/

gassho2
Tairin
Sat today and lah

I will give this a listen gassho1

Gassho,
Tom

SatLah

[StoBird]

I’ve always loved this Ted talk, he explains conventional non-Shikantaza wise and insightful paradoxical non-paradoxical gratitude better than I ever could: https://www.ted.com/talks/andrew_solomon_how_the_worst_moments_in_our_lives_ make_us_who_we_are/up-next?language=en

I’m aware that in Dharmic gratitude we forge non-meaning and build non-identity identity and meaning through dropping all identity and meaning (or rather, we become all identities and go beyond all meaning) as we sit in zazen and then off the cushion, with the personal walls of separation a little softer, we can use the forging of personal meaning and the building of identity as a powerful way to change the world for the better and help the less fortunate.

...the meaning (in the Victor Frankl sense, that snuffs out suffering) of the wholeness and completeness that is Dharmic gratitude is beyond all personal forging of meaning and building of identity, is what I’m trying to say.

Gassho,
Tom

SatLah