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Jundo
09-20-2017, 04:00 PM
I listened today to a good interview with author Alexander Weinstein on his new book of short stories "Children of the New World" ... about technology, media and how it all is changing us ...


Weinstein’s stories jump all over in terms of when exactly they take place in the future and what has befallen humanity, but they all revolve around the notion of human connection and how technology tends to mediate and reshape it. The promise of the internet, according to Weinstein, was a tool for uniting marginalized or small groups, for bringing together lost friends and loved ones and creating safe communities for individuals who thought they were alone.

“The difficulty becomes that there's a way that we're also thwarted online,” says Weinstein. “With online dating, somebody can fall in love. But on the flip side, it also teaches you to like swipe people into the trash that you don't like.”

Interview here: https://www.ttbook.org/interview/partial-glossary-horrifying-future

A good caution for a primarily online Buddhist group!

But one story in particular grabbed me, his story about illegal enlightenment parlors called ...


Moksha n. An illegal form of enlightenment gained by running data directly through the brain, often through the repurposing of aging electronics from video game consoles and circuit boards linked to tinfoil headgear.

"Moksha, it turned out, wasn't bullshit. It'd just gone into hiding ever since the twenties when the U.S. cracked down on Nepali distribution. There had been nonstop busts at yoga studios and health spas in the U.S. An oxygen bar in Sedona had been found with makeshift crown plates hooked up to an old Sega Genesis console. The CIA had confiscated the equipment and sentenced the owners, a gray-haired, dreadlocked couple, to life."

“In this world, the U.S. government has cracked down on these virtual enlightenment drugs that can get you to different states of Buddhist or Sufi liberation,” explains Weinstein. “And the U.S. government is cracking down on these sort of meth lab equivalences where people are cannibalizing old Genesis and Nintendo systems and creating these almost tinfoil caps that you can wear. It's very sketchy.”

A taste ...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=28&v=SM-WuXklbEo

My Dharma Bro. Brad Warner once had a good comment regarding some possible drug or technology that could provide such experiences. Basically, it is just a brain trip without the whole thing becoming part of the bones to be actually mastered and lived in life ...


Let’s say you met a veteran mountaineer with over a quarter century of climbing experience, a person who has written books on mountain climbing and routinely personally instructs others in the art of climbing. And let’s imagine what would happen if you tried to convince this guy that people who take helicopters to the tops of mountains get everything that mountain climbers get and get it a whole lot easier.

The mountain climber would certainly tell you that the breathtaking view a guy who takes a helicopter to the top of a mountain gets is not in any way, shape or form the same view that a person who climbs the mountain herself gets.

To the mountain climber, the guy in the helicopter is just a hyperactive thrill seeker who wants nothing more than to experience a pretty view without putting any effort into it. The helicopter guy thinks the goal of mountain climbing is to be on top of the mountain and that climbing is an inefficient way to accomplish this goal. He just doesn’t get it. At all.

The helicopter guy misses out on the amazing sights there are to see on the way up. He doesn’t know the thrill of mastering the mountain through his own efforts. He doesn’t know the hardships and dangers involved in making the climb. And he’ll never know the awesome wonder of descending the mountain back into familiar territory. All he’s done is given some money to a person who owns a helicopter. He probably couldn’t even find the mountain himself, let alone make it to the top. When there are no helicopters around, the poor guy is helplessly grounded.

If the helicopter guy claims that he has reached the same place as the mountain climber, the mountain climber knows in ways the helicopter guy can’t even fathom that the helicopter guy is a fool.

To a mountain climber, the goal of mountain climbing is not the moment of sitting on top enjoying the view. That’s just one small part of the experience. It may not even be the best part. To a mountain climber, every view, from every point on the mountain is significant and wonderful.

People who think that the pinnacle of the experience is that moment of being right on the tippy-top, don’t understand the experience at all. The poor attention addled things probably never will.

What I am working on in meditation involves every single moment of life. So-called “peak experiences” can be fun. But they no more define what life is about that so-called “mundane experiences.” In fact mundane experiences are actually more what life is about than the thrilling ones. When you start thinking only your most thrilling experiences are important, you have already lost the most precious thing in life, the ability to fully immerse yourself in every experience.

No. Taking a helicopter to the top of a mountain is not at all the same thing as climbing it for yourself. To insist that it is proves that you don’t understand the first thing about mountains.

http://hardcorezen.info/drugs-meditation-and-mountain-climbing/5388

gassho1

Gassho, Jundo

SatTodayLAH

Tairin
09-21-2017, 12:14 AM
I really like the quote from Brad Warner you provided.

Gassho
Warren
Sat today & LAH

Mp
09-21-2017, 01:42 AM
Hey Jundo,

Very interesting, thank you for this. =)

Gassho
Shingen

SatToday/LAH

Washin
09-21-2017, 08:25 AM
Thank you, Jundo gassho1

Gassho
Washin
sat today

Eishuu
09-21-2017, 08:53 AM
There is actually some guy who has experimented with stimulating a certain part of the brain to induce 'spiritual experiences' and often visions of God. Here it is https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_helmet It sounds a bit scientifically questionable though.

Wouldn't one of the possibilities of inducing Enlightenment experiences be a possible increase in suffering when returning to a 'normal' way of perceiving? I imagine that because the experience didn't happen when the mind was ready and the conditions were right and as it wouldn't be particularly integrated, it could cause more problems: an increase in craving (for peak experiences) and maybe even some kind of adverse reaction making the ego hold on even tighter. I think I've read about that with approaches that emphasize peak experiences generally. Does that sound right?

Gassho
Lucy
ST/LAH

misa.myro
09-26-2017, 06:26 PM
Beautiful quote, thank you for that.

Michaela
Sat today, lah

JimH
10-05-2017, 05:29 PM
A very good point overall, and a great quote! I find myself chuckling sometimes when someone says something like, "I know how you feel" or "I know what you're going through"......eh, *maybe*....but the mountain YOU climbed and the mountain I'M climbing are different.

I have always believed that to truly understand an experience, you have to fully immerse in it....a helicopter trip is certainly not the same as climbing. In the case of Treeleaf, true we are online and it is not the same as sitting in a zendo, but people *are* sitting with each other virtually, not just posting about sitting (at least, that's the assumption, right?). The "climb" is the same, even if the physical location is different.

Fascinating stuff. Thanks again, Jundo!

Gassho--

--JimH (SatToday!)

Shokai
10-06-2017, 01:29 AM
Originally posted by JimH;
but people *are* sitting with each other virtually, not just posting about sitting
Exactly, and how much more virtual is that than sitting with someone in the same virtual Samara that we've lived in for our entire lives. It is the only way in which we can experience this visual world. Give Shikantaza a chance and you can experience the whole Universe. gassho2

gassho, Shokai

sat/LAH

Jundo
10-06-2017, 03:08 AM
but people *are* sitting with each other virtually, not just posting about sitting (at least, that's the assumption, right?).

I have been in enough monasteries and Zen Centers to know that, while somebody might cross their legs and face the wall, in their heads they may be 3000 miles away from there. I have been so too sometimes. People might look like they are sitting together, but their minds and hearts are not.


Exactly, and how much more virtual is that than sitting with someone in the same virtual Samara that we've lived in for our entire lives.

Yes. Folks forget that, Basic Buddhism 101, this whole experience of "Samsara" (day to day world) is at least largely a "virtual" creation happening between our ears with all the ideas, judgments, categories, self/other divisions that we impose. We do not realize that even the chairs we are sitting on are just atoms or pieces of wood in a certain configuration until our minds (in communication with our asses) assign the identity and qualities of "chair" to such a thing. Perhaps our Sangha is a little lesson in seeing that fact too.

Gassho, Jundo (also atoms of a configuration)

SatTodayLAH