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Thread: Buddhists and their teachers

  1. #51
    Treeleaf Unsui Dosho's Avatar
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    Re: Buddhists and their teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by disastermouse
    Wow. First off - lots of 'teacher-pleasing' going on in this thread. Everybody wants to please teacher, to get an 'A+' - it's natural, normal, and probably not conscious - but boy is it going on here.
    Care to provide an example? I don't see it, but as I said before, that's nothing new.

    If you can't, I might just have to decide that you are full of it.

    Gassho,
    Dosho

  2. #52

    Re: Buddhists and their teachers

    I would totally go along with Jundo and say that, of course, a teacher doesn't require the student to always agree. But indeed to experience, try, make the thing alive in his or her life. And that takes a lot of questioning.To be able to hold both, acceptance and doubt in one go, one word and one breath is tricky. So many of us tend to shift from one to another ( I am no exception to this, duality is my daily bread).

    You right Stephanie, I have quite a dislike for agrressive behaviour and strong words, maybe I am getting too old for this, or had too much in my face in my career as a teacher. I just think things can be said in a balanced tone of voice.Most of the time, Loud is not necessary.

    Thank you Chet for your post because it also helps me to understand how things work for you. Cryptic... sure enough. Well, some people find my prose quite clear, some others don't. If you listen to Jundo, you will find great clarity, sharpness and precision. Great knowledge too. Jundo is on Manjushri side, the sword and clarity of wisdom. This is his style. I am the other guy, more poetic, fluid, quite fond of koans actually, more the Kannon side, dirty sometimes, ordinary. Two ways to convey the same basic teaching and speak to people.

    As to being French, I take no offense but I would like to tell you thatTaigu- Froggy has been working and thinking in English for more than twenty five years, and if spelling is certainly faulty at times, it is not altogether that bad :wink: .


    gassho


    Taigu

  3. #53

    Re: Buddhists and their teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Taigu
    ... and if spelling is certainly faulty at times, it is not altogether that bad :wink: .


    Actually, better than most Americans ... given our school systems. 8)

    (you see ... everything I write, I'm trying to please Taigu) :wink:

  4. #54
    disastermouse
    Guest

    Re: Buddhists and their teachers

    Taigu,

    It was meant as a goodhearted jab. As if to say, 'who understands the French anyway?'

    There may be times when you want me to do something or look at something specific and subtlety will be lost on me then.

    But there are times I think where you seem to be seeking just to awaken the mind and plant a small seed - and you do have that effect on me when you are sparse or poetic. If you drop a hint and I don't get it, it's because it got lost in my messy mind. Maybe I didn't or couldn't allow enough space for it to get rooted because it just got blown away by the very next thing. It may feel like I'm especially dense or careless and it may be frustrating. I think I'll make an effort to make more time before I respond to posts like those now that I'm understanding that it may be helpful.

    I really do appreciate you guys! For some reason I have a very hard time with trust in this one area. I think that for so long, there wasn't anyone with whom to share this practice and so I became very independent. Even though I have faith in you and Jundo (a lot more than I express), some part of me is reluctant to give up any of that independence. In the earlier days of my practice when there was no one of like mind around, I was constantly defending what seems, without personally experiencing it, to be a very strange thing.

    I am used to being misunderstood and I think I haven't been able to realize that some of your critique is NOT a misunderstanding of me but an attempt to point out to me the incompleteness of my view.

    Chet

  5. #55

    Re: Buddhists and their teachers

    Chet,

    Imperfect as I am, I do share the same reluctance to listen. Maybe that's what makes me so good at spotting it in others We are all working on it...

    gassho

    Taigu

  6. #56
    disastermouse
    Guest

    Re: Buddhists and their teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Dosho
    Quote Originally Posted by disastermouse
    Wow. First off - lots of 'teacher-pleasing' going on in this thread. Everybody wants to please teacher, to get an 'A+' - it's natural, normal, and probably not conscious - but boy is it going on here.
    Care to provide an example? I don't see it, but as I said before, that's nothing new.

    If you can't, I might just have to decide that you are full of it.

    Gassho,
    Dosho
    You're the example, Dosho.

    Chet

  7. #57

    Re: Buddhists and their teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Taigu
    I would totally go along with Jundo and say that, of course, a teacher doesn't require the student to always agree. But indeed to experience, try, make the thing alive in his or her life. And that takes a lot of questioning.
    I guess it's not about questioning, it's about how questions arise. If they are humble, consecrated, open, bodhicitta-based, growthful ... superb. If they are defending, self-dulling, avoiding reality, arising out of mental habit ... not so superb, time for the stick.

  8. #58
    Treeleaf Unsui Dosho's Avatar
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    Re: Buddhists and their teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by disastermouse
    Quote Originally Posted by Dosho
    Quote Originally Posted by disastermouse
    Wow. First off - lots of 'teacher-pleasing' going on in this thread. Everybody wants to please teacher, to get an 'A+' - it's natural, normal, and probably not conscious - but boy is it going on here.
    Care to provide an example? I don't see it, but as I said before, that's nothing new.

    If you can't, I might just have to decide that you are full of it.

    Gassho,
    Dosho
    You're the example, Dosho.

    Chet
    No teacher pleasing was being attempted...I'm just that lame and goody two shoes. :lol: And my post about you and Stephanie was genuine...I wish I did understand you both, but I don't and I wish I had a friend who had my back the way you do for each other. My loss.

  9. #59
    Senior Member AlanLa's Avatar
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    Re: Buddhists and their teachers

    Teacher pleasing here??? Oh yes! If only I could get Jundo to do it more often :twisted: :lol: :wink: :mrgreen:

  10. #60

    Re: Buddhists and their teachers

    Hey Chet,
    I didn't want to let this post slid by without acknowledging that both Jundo and Taigu are gentlemen perhaps better said gentle-men or just gentle. They are very refreshing in a society with more than its share of self serving in your face skeptics. For all they do at Treeleaf they receive 0 pay and accept 0 contributions. While disagreement and questioning are certainly required in our practice it can be done with kindness and understanding.
    Oh yeah by the way I've dealt with my share of hard ass in your face attitudes while running a trucking company. Just in case you're looking for what the f..k do I know credentials about the difference between hard asses and gentlemen.
    Now I can get back to practicing my bowing.
    Gassho, Shogen

  11. #61

    Re: Buddhists and their teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by AlanLa
    I am curious, do you think Buddhists relate to their teachers differently than in other religions? but in Buddhism they say that's fine, go find another.
    Personally, of course there are certain "way of doings things" that will be Buddhist. But. As in most human relations, I think you will see similarities. In the Sufi tradition, for example, a teacher is emphasized. But. You are free move on to find another teacher and as far as I know you will not be consider some type of "sinner" for doing so. In more urbanized areas or larger towns, in Catholic and Christian faith, folks will "shop" for the right church. Even in a more rigid structure that is the Catholic church, I know folks that will look for the right priest and community. If you leave that church and priest, you will be fine. Of course, if you leave the Catholic Church that is another matter. :twisted:


    ....and btw....I think this thread may be starting to need a:


  12. #62

    Re: Buddhists and their teachers

    yea, it must be done cause I think someone stuck a fork in it.

  13. #63

    Re: Buddhists and their teachers

    Or put it another way, Scott, if the stick doesn't work, I kick people's heads and crush their bones. Maybe you would like to come along and chew some of them with me? :twisted: :wink:

    gassho

    Taigu

  14. #64
    Senior Member AlanLa's Avatar
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    Re: Buddhists and their teachers

    MEAT!!!! Rare meat!!! :evil:
    Eat the teacher!!!!!! Oh Yeah!!!! :shock:
    Or is it teacher eating the student!!!!! Ummm... yuck :evil:
    Uh, maybe its teacher and student consuming each other, hmmm... :?
    Oh, that tastes good :!:
    Wait, where did the teacher and student go :?:

  15. #65
    disastermouse
    Guest

    Re: Buddhists and their teachers

    Hey guys,

    I just wanted to check into this thread and say that - yeah - Jundo hit it on the button. I just signed on staff and I'm stressing a lot. It's not all bad stress, but I'm certainly more anxious than usual.

    I'm sorry if I've offended anyone...I'll post more about the whole move thing and whatnot in the 'Everyday' forum.

    Chet

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