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Thread: Kinhin Question

  1. #1

    Kinhin Question

    Hello Fellow Leafers;

    When engaged in walking meditation, are there any guidelines as to how to handle turning - the space I walk in is somewhat confined (about a 10 foot (3 metre) space). When I "hit the wall", do I simply do a 180 (like aikido style)?

    Thanks for your thoughts,
    -Jim

  2. #2

    Re: Kinhin Question

    Quote Originally Posted by Sloppy_Zen
    Hello Fellow Leafers;

    When engaged in walking meditation, are there any guidelines as to how to handle turning - the space I walk in is somewhat confined (about a 10 foot (3 metre) space). When I "hit the wall", do I simply do a 180 (like aikido style)?

    Thanks for your thoughts,
    -Jim
    Are you in a small room or ....?

    There is no distance. No start and finish. And vice versa. :P But. My humble suggestion is if it's a very small room. Just do best with the space you have and don't worry about degrees or turns. Just walk.

    Of course, how it's done in a monastery maybe something else. :wink:

  3. #3

    Re: Kinhin Question

    Quote Originally Posted by chicanobudista
    Quote Originally Posted by Sloppy_Zen
    Hello Fellow Leafers;

    When engaged in walking meditation, are there any guidelines as to how to handle turning - the space I walk in is somewhat confined (about a 10 foot (3 metre) space). When I "hit the wall", do I simply do a 180 (like aikido style)?

    Thanks for your thoughts,
    -Jim
    Are you in a small room or ....?

    There is no distance. No start and finish. And vice versa. :P But. My humble suggestion is if it's a very small room. Just do best with the space you have and don't worry about degrees or turns. Just walk.

    Of course, how it's done in a monastery maybe something else. :wink:
    Yes, no long no short ... no place to turn.

    You can watch me on some of the Saturday sittings. I tend to turn 90 degrees all at once, a bit like a soldier in the Japanese way.

    http://www.shambhalasun.com/sunspace/?p=13784

    But there is no right or wrong way to turn, really. I would say, just turn with sincerity, vigor, equanimity and non-thinking, and the turn is complete before you even move!

    Having visited 1000 Zen groups in Japan and the West, I will tell you that there are as many variations as people. When in Rome, do as the Romans do.

    Gassho, Jundo

  4. #4

    Re: Kinhin Question

    Quote Originally Posted by Jundo
    Having visited 1000 Zen groups in Japan and the West, I will tell you that there are as many variations as people. When in Rome, do as the Romans do.
    A year or two ago, I was bit surprised to see Rinzai walking meditation turn into...a quick brisk walking. :shock:

    And here are some examples of Buddhist Walking Meditation:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_IFvablc6EI[/video]]
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdO1vZJgUu0[/video]] (Walking Meditation with Thich Nhat Hanh)
    http://www.howcast.com/videos/2433-How- ... Meditation
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cO8N75uJiCA[/video]] :mrgreen:

  5. #5

    Re: Kinhin Question

    Quote Originally Posted by chicanobudista
    Quote Originally Posted by Jundo
    Having visited 1000 Zen groups in Japan and the West, I will tell you that there are as many variations as people. When in Rome, do as the Romans do.
    A year or two ago, I was bit surprised to see Rinzai walking meditation turn into...a quick brisk walking. :shock:

    And here are some examples of Buddhist Walking Meditation:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_IFvablc6EI[/video]]
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdO1vZJgUu0[/video]] (Walking Meditation with Thich Nhat Hanh)
    http://www.howcast.com/videos/2433-How- ... Meditation
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cO8N75uJiCA[/video]] :mrgreen:
    The only thing I would say, looking at those different flavors of walking meditation by different Buddhist teachers from various traditions, is that the practice of Kinhin in the Soto way is moving Shikantaza ... movement as stillness, walking ahead yet no place to reach, constant total arriving with each step, neither fast nor slow whatever the speed, a single inch containing endless lightyears ...

    Gassho, J

  6. #6

    Re: Kinhin Question

    The only thing I haven't seen mentioned is turning clockwise. I think that's universally true, isn't it? I'm far from having visited thousands of centers. :-)

  7. #7

    Re: Kinhin Question

    Quote Originally Posted by scott
    The only thing I haven't seen mentioned is turning clockwise. I think that's universally true, isn't it? I'm far from having visited thousands of centers. :-)
    Hi Scott,

    Well, I have found that it depends on the room. I have been with groups where people rise from their Zafu, turn to face the room and turn left (counter-clockwise).

    Also, in a large Sodo monk's hall (as in the attached drawing), it gets rather compicated, and would depend which side of the room you are sitting on, and whether you are in the middle seats or near the wall ... some turn left, some right.



    When in Rome, turn as the Romans do.

    Gassho, J

  8. #8

    Re: Kinhin Question

    Quote Originally Posted by Jundo
    Aside: I'm in post-vacation work mode, which always gets me a little weird, and when I see this image I think there must be a hilarious caption you could put on it .

    Thanks as always ... Scott

  9. #9

    Re: Kinhin Question

    This is from Bodhi Manda Zen Center (Rinzai):

    Bodhidharma's Shoe
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ITnmOJbR5uU[/video]]

    see 10:06 & 11:02

  10. #10

    Re: Kinhin Question

    Quote Originally Posted by Jundo


    Here are three good videos from 1959 from Sojiji:

    http://monkeymindonline.blogspot.com/20 ... dhist.html

    Life in a Japanese Soto Zen Buddhist Monastery

    I don't know the origins of this visit to Sojiji, one of the two major training temples of Japanese Soto Zen Buddhism, but the visuals, if not the commentary (which is astonishingly bad), are wonderful. The Youtube description says it was filmed in 1959. I'm guessing for BBC or somesuch...
    See Video 1 @ 1:16 for kinhin monastic style.

  11. #11

    Re: Kinhin Question

    Thank you all for those videos - will keep me busy for awhile!

    -Jim

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