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Thread: Jukai and Empowerments

  1. #1

    Jukai and Empowerments

    Hi, Everyone,

    It's a question that I've been meaning to ask for a while now and keep forgetting to! Good memory, just short!

    Is the Jukai Ceremony the same as the Tibetan Lineages Empowerment?

    I've gathered from various posts that some of you are aquainted with Tibetan Buddhism. If anyone knows, I'd really appreciate input.

    Thanks a lot,
    Lora

  2. #2
    Senior Member Kent's Avatar
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    Re: Jukai and Empowerments

    I believe there are many empowerments offered in Tibetan Buddhism. Jukai seems to be similar to the "Taking Refuge" ceremony. Please correct me if i am wrong. Gasso Kent

  3. #3

    Re: Jukai and Empowerments

    Thanks, Kent,

    There are many empowerments, yes. In fact, the monks used to warn against racking up empowerments for bragging rights. Chogyam Trungpa called it "spiritual materialism". However, in my experience there was no formal ceremony for Taking Refuge. At the beginning of Pujas, taking refuge in Buddha, Dharma and Sangha was chanted but there was no specific retreat or making of rakusus or that kind of thing. The lineage I was with did not always adhere to strictly Tibetan things, thinking, I would assume, a lot of it to be a cultural thing, not necessarily good for the west, or even appropriate.

    The reason I was asking is that if empowerments are the same as Jukai, then would there potentially be some sort of conflict of interest or even plain bad manners if I were to take Jukai here.

    Lora

  4. #4
    Senior Member Kent's Avatar
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    Re: Jukai and Empowerments

    Lora, try this link.http://www.purifymind.com/MeaningTakeFefuge.htm. Gassho Kent

  5. #5

    Re: Jukai and Empowerments

    Hi, Kent,

    I've printed the material from the link and I'm going to read it, other folk want the computer.

    I appreciate your time and effort, thanks!

    Many blessings,
    Lora

  6. #6

    Re: Jukai and Empowerments

    Quote Originally Posted by no hobby for me
    Lora, try this link.http://www.purifymind.com/MeaningTakeFefuge.htm. Gassho Kent
    Hi Kent,

    This is an excellent article, so much so that I am going to add it to our Precepts study reading for this week. The perspectives on the Refuges expressed by the Tibetan teacher in the article are very nice and ring true, I think.

    Quote Originally Posted by lora

    The reason I was asking is that if empowerments are the same as Jukai, then would there potentially be some sort of conflict of interest or even plain bad manners if I were to take Jukai here.

    Lora
    I cannot speak for whether a "Jukai" constitutes an "empowerment" or not, and you need to consult your friendly neighborhood Tulku on that question. But I can say that, from my point of view, there cannot possibly be any "conflict" in "taking Refuge" or undertaking to abide by the Precepts ... it is something you can do any time, again and again, with any group.

    I have heard stories of some Zen Sangha insisting that, to "join the Sangha officially", one must take or retake Jukai there under their procedures ... not recognizing Jukai from some other place. But I have never encountered that personally, and I think it rare. I do not even think that "Jukai" is necessary to "join the Sangha", and anyone sitting with the Sangha with some feeling of commitment is "the Sangha". As well, anyone trying to learn from the Buddha's teachings, and put them into Practice, is a "Buddhist" ... you do not need a ceremony or special clothes for that. Instead, I know people (like me!!) who have taken Jukai several times with a few different Sangha and teachers (I have done it at Soji-ji, with Jiho Sargent and with Nishijima Roshi). In order to do so, I think you need to feel a certain loyalty, commitment and dedication to the Sangha and teacher (and his/her teachings) there ... but I feel that to all those folks in special ways.

    Does that help answer your question?

    Gassho, THE LAMA

  7. #7

    Re: Jukai and Empowerments

    Hello,

    Thank you, Jundo and Kent.

    The article was excellent.

    Yes, everything that was said has helped me.

    Many blessings,
    Lora

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