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Thread: 12 Nidanas and a Man with an arrow in his eye

  1. #1

    12 Nidanas and a Man with an arrow in his eye

    Hi everyone!

    I would really appreciate any help on where I can read more on the whole chain of the dependent origination and the 12 nidanas, links in the chain of mental habituation. (Preferbaly, on the Internet ).

    The one called Feeling (in tranlsation to English) has a powerful (and creepy) image of a man with an arrow in his eye illustrating it. Contact gives rise to feelings of attachment and aversion, depending on the nature of the contact - I get so much. But does the image mean to convey that ANY feeling actually has something dark to it, some suffering in its base? Probably because we already have the desire - to have or not to have - which means we are attached to something already?

    Anyone?

    Namasté,

    Irina

  2. #2

    Re: 12 Nidanas and a Man with an arrow in his eye

    Quote Originally Posted by CinnamonGal
    Hi everyone!

    I would really appreciate any help on where I can read more on the whole chain of the dependent origination and the 12 nidanas, links in the chain of mental habituation. (Preferbaly, on the Internet ).

    The one called Feeling (in tranlsation to English) has a powerful (and creepy) image of a man with an arrow in his eye illustrating it. Contact gives rise to feelings of attachment and aversion, depending on the nature of the contact - I get so much. But does the image mean to convey that ANY feeling actually has something dark to it, some suffering in its base? Probably because we already have the desire - to have or not to have - which means we are attached to something already?

    Anyone?

    Namasté,

    Irina
    Hi Irina,

    When we get into the Heart Sutra talks on the "Sit-a-Long" (starting probably tonight), I will take it as an opportunity to review the Four Noble Truths, Eightfold Path, and Twelvefold Chain of Causation (which is dependent origination and the "Nidanas"), and some others. Basic Buddhist philosophy, all absolutely central to what we do around here. I will try to point folks to additional reading too.

    You know, I have recently gone back to read many of the Pali Suttas, the oldest statements of doctrine attributed to the "Big Guy" Shakyamuni. There are some differences in approach here and there, some cases where he preaches different ideas (of Zazen, for example) to different people (he taught many different "techniques"), and some things that we do not emphasize in quite the same way (I am not a literalist for a mechanical conception of rebirth) ... HOWEVER, reading the Suttas reinforced my conviction that we are practicing just what the old boy preached, and those concepts of Buddhist philosophy and our approach to them are the same now as then. Soto Zen, and the way we practice it at Treeleaf, is actually quite orthodox and faithful to the original teachings. In fact, it is amazing how the Buddha's original words fit perfectly with the Zen flavor to Buddhism which, of course, developed much later when the teachings came to China and Japan and were molded and polished by those cultures.

    It is a big subject, and I will leave it for my talks on the "Sit-a-Long".

    Gassho, Jundo

  3. #3

    Re: 12 Nidanas and a Man with an arrow in his eye

    Jundo,

    Thank you for the reply. I guess you saw the underlying question I had :lol: and answered it. I would really like to read more of the "Big Guy's" words but there is just so much and it is hard to know what to start with.

    As to the sit-a-longs, I missed the one with the duck and the first one on Heart Sutra - the video kept loading but never really loaded that one time I tried the other night (maybe because of all the heavy traffic you brought onto the page by going "natural" :lol: , even after I updated Flash. I will try again of course and I am very very glad to hear you will be taking up those questions and recommending some reading. It is the Buddha's insights about the causes of human suffering and his Four Noble Truths that brought me to Buddhism and changed my whole understanding of life and how I can relate to the world and I would like to get more grounded in the basics especially since as you say they are central to what we do here.

    Just a couple of questions about the 12 Nidanas (maybe you were thinking of addressing them anyways but still :wink: ): do we have to break that chain to reduce our suffering and stop going in circles? Does having "an arrow in one's eye" mean this is what it "feels" like to be awake?

    Gassho,

    Irina

    PS I guess that arrow in the eye will keep me wondering for a while

  4. #4

    Re: 12 Nidanas and a Man with an arrow in his eye

    Quote Originally Posted by CinnamonGal

    Just a couple of questions about the 12 Nidanas (maybe you were thinking of addressing them anyways but still :wink: ): do we have to break that chain to reduce our suffering and stop going in circles? Does having "an arrow in one's eye" mean this is what it "feels" like to be awake?
    Yes, our practice involves "breaking the chain" that creates a sense of self, resistance to the world and judgments about the world, attachments, and on and on. I will talk about that more.

    The one called Feeling (in tranlsation to English) has a powerful (and creepy) image of a man with an arrow in his eye illustrating it. Contact gives rise to feelings of attachment and aversion, depending on the nature of the contact - I get so much. But does the image mean to convey that ANY feeling actually has something dark to it, some suffering in its base? Probably because we already have the desire - to have or not to have - which means we are attached to something already?
    You mean this:

    http://personal.carthage.edu/jlochtefel ... danas.html

    Well, the whole process give rise to a sense of self, craving and attachment. Big topic that I will get into ... but not right now.

    Gassho, J

  5. #5

    Re: 12 Nidanas and a Man with an arrow in his eye

    Thanks Jundo!

    I look forward to the talks!

    Gassho,

    Irina

  6. #6

    Re: 12 Nidanas and a Man with an arrow in his eye

    Hi Irina.

    the video kept loading but never really loaded that one time I tried the other night
    I was actually having the same problem this morning. It worked when I tried at a diffrent time.

    Gassho Will

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