Balancing practice

[adrianbkelly]

Hi everyone,
I'd be very grateful of some advice, as I am having trouble balancing my practice. I keep going from one extreme to the other. For a while, my enthusiasm is such that I can't wait to sit every day & will get up early every weekend to sit zazenkai. All I read is Zen books & websites & all I listen to is Zen podcasts & Dharma talks. It doesn't affect my relationship with my wife or my job, but all my other interests go out the window.

Then, all of a sudden, I'll realise that I miss my other interests & I want nothing to do with Zen. I lose all interest in sitting & reading, I stop logging in here (although I'm so shy to post anyway, that I'm sure no-one notices ) & I lose all momentum in my practice. Then, inevitably, I will realise how much I miss practice & the whole cycle begins again.........

I've tried giving up all together, but the Dharma has been part of my life for 20 years &, in my heart, I know this is the path for me. Does anyone have any thoughts on how I can keep up a steady practice, without going overboard?

_/\_
Ade

[KellyRok]

Hi Ade,

I think this is a very good question; because personally, this has happened to me as well.

Maybe you could designate a specific amount of time each day for Zen activities. Try sitting for 30 minutes and read or listen to dharma talks for 30 minutes. Don't go over this allotted time each day; when the time is up, move on to your other interests. Try that for a while and see if it is enough time and then you can adjust as needed.

I tend to overplan things at times, so maybe this will work for you maybe not. I will be interested to see what others can offer here.

Gassho,
Kelly/Jinmei
satbrieflytoday

[Kokuu]

Hi Ade

This has been something I have experienced too. Over time things have become naturally more balanced but sometimes I feel more enthusiastic about dharma activities than others.

Kelly offers good advice about planning sitting and study and sticking to it. If that feels too structured then at least try and maintain sitting during periods of low enthusiasm (and perhaps checking in to Treeleaf every couple of days) and give yourself a limit of how much time you will spend on Zen activities during the more intense phases. Making one day a week deliberately 'Zen free' aside from sitting may help maintain some balance.

In essence, don't let practice be completely dictated by how you feel. Sit even when you don't feel like it, and sometimes put down the books and podcasts when you still want more. It is great to have enthusiasm but still getting to the cushion when we really don't want to is an important part of being consistent. Hell, some days I would prefer to be doing anything else but sitting with the resistance allows me to see it dissolve away (or sometimes not!).

People here often tend to come and go based on their personal circumstances so if no one notices it is not because you are not considered an important part of the sangha (you are!) but because we are used to people dipping in and out.

Gassho
Kokuu
#sattoday

[Yugen]

Ade,
Perhaps a reasonable or easily maintained amount of zazen, reading and Treeleaf on a regular basis might help to neutralize the competition for time between Zen and your other interests. I don't know how long your zazen sessions are, but a manageable time (plug in your own goal - 10 minutes? 20 minutes?) daily, leaving some appetite, which also allows for other interests. Maybe settting this up as less of a binary equation or competition for time also points you towards the middle way. Our practice is a marathon, not a sprint. Be gentle with your heart, the Dharma is there and it is fine to be an often silent witness to conversations here. I also struggle with frequent posting.

It might also help to set up a schedule with partner here at Treeleaf to meet once or twice a week for a short zazen. Getting on a schedule and supporting someone's practice is helpful, even if it is 15 minutes once per week.

It's good to see you, and thank you for your post!

Deep bows
Yugen

[Mp]

Hello Ade,

I think we have all fallen into this trap before, so not too worry. =) For me one of the things I do and Jinmei made a point to it is, not to over schedule or over do it. Trying to cram a lot of stuff in can sometimes make us choose this over that.

For sitting I make it a daily routine like washing my face and eating breakfast. That time is scheduled and I make sure that I have enough time to do it (of course life can have other ideas at times and we also need to be flexible to those changes) ... whether you sit 15 mins or 30 mins is up to you, but set the time aside. Like now for example, I am writing to you while enjoying my breakfast ... getting some reading/learning in and fueling the body for the day ahead. Once done, then continue with life, work, family, playtime, etc. =)

The old saying, too much of a good thing is not so good ... little bits at a time of all things in life will help us find balance. =)

Gassho
Shingen

SatToday

[alan.r]

Hi Ade,

I've been there before. It still comes and goes a bit, but really what I've felt over time is that when this kind of thing happens, I'm separating my life into neat little sections. So that what I'm really doing is going "oh, here's zen stuff over here and it's great" and then when I get tired of it, I go, "oh yeah, here's this cool stuff I forgot, music or art, and now I want to do that." Really that's just needless separation, the mind chasing "interests." Not that it's bad to have interests, but it is a form of separation, as though zen is just this stuff over here. Is there a way to see zen in your other interests? Maybe better, is there a way to drop zen and drop Buddhism and live it at once with your other interests. For me, coming to see that all my activities have the flavor of zazen, that is important. Not that I go around thinking about zen all the time. I don't. But also, not separating things either. This is what it means when Jundo says bring your zazen off the cushion. To me anyway. Mountains are mountains, right?

Gassho,
Alan
sattoday

[Jundo]

The Middle Way.

Like the lute strings, not too tight or too lose.

And like playing an instrument, keep it interesting and enjoyable (nobody said Buddhism had to be a painful grind ... even if there are grindy days sometimes) and keep practicing at a nice, steady pace. Play the music that makes your heart sing.

Some good advice from folks above.

Gassho, J

SatToday

[Troy]

Hi, I go through those cycles too. I think it is normal for a lot of people. For myself, I try to sit everyday even if I am not on the forum or doing a lot of reading. This way, at least I am doing something and it not does feel like a lot of pressure on myself. I really enjoy sitting. I sit on my lunch break at work because that is the one time of the day I get total me time so it does not conflict with the rest of my responsibilities. That is what works for me any way.


..sat2day•

[Kyonin]

Hi,

Yes, I've been there before... oh so many times.

I think it's a natural part of our learning process. Don't worry, the day will come when your interests turn naturally to another thing.

Just be mindful of not falling into obsession. The Middle Way is always the Way to go.

Gassho,

Kyonin
#SatToday

[Josan]

The Middle way definitely . Although, I find that it can be hard to determine what exactly is the middle way in much of our lives these days. Moderation in all things seems to be a useful maxim. Too much is as Kyonin points out "obsession" and one must be be aware of this too. I know that zazen is supposed to be enough in itself but I also find that I need to spend some time during the week reading about zen etc. and can easily go overboard with this activity. Note to (non) self: moderation moderation moderation

Gassho,
David

sattoday

[Jundo]

I know that zazen is supposed to be enough in itself but I also find that I need to spend some time during the week reading about zen etc. and can easily go overboard with this activity. Note to (non) self: moderation moderation moderation

Gassho,

Zazen is enough in itself ... when sitting Zazen! But that does not mean we should not do other things, like read a book or do the dishes.

However, even then ... all things in moderation and with balance.

Gassho, J

SatToday (and read a book and did some dishes)

[Heisoku]

Good to know we all go through this. I was talking to a friend about this and we both agreed that despite all the stresses and hard times, a day without zazen just doesn't sit right.
Gassho Heisoku
Sat today

[Jinyo]

Hello Ade,

Seems like we all go through these cycles. I tend to burn up and burn out on the reading front. I have quite a conflict with this at times. Sitting is not such an issue - it's become a natural
part of my day now and because it feels natural I don't give it a lot of thought.

There is 'something' about the intellectual/reading/listening/thinking/discussing aspect of dharma that makes me want to investigate what the pull is and why I sometimes go overboard on the effort. I dare say we might all have a slightly different answer to this question.

Re - the Middle Way, it's a healthy default position to have in many areas of life and one of the main reasons I felt drawn to the dharma. But - as you describe - I often feel pulled away from that position and sabotage the peace of sitting with mental activity.

Lots of wise advice here,

I need to heed it myself

Gassho

Willow

sat today

[Risho]

I think just must be a normal thing for humans.. ups and downs with everything. For me, it's easy to sit with the ups, but when the downs hit, then I don't want to sit... that's the most important time to sit because slowly maybe it helps you to not listen to yourself, take your wants so seriously.

Gassho,

Risho
-sattoday

[Kyotai]

Already lots said here but I too have experience this.

Here with you

Gassho, Kyotai
Sat today

[Rich]

There was a time that I thought that Zen was an obsessive compulsive disorder. But it was actually me that was so. I think the turning point was when I started finding peace and ease in just sitting, at least sometimes. For me, sitting morning and evening has maintained my momentum in this practice . If I have time reading is nice. Visiting Treeleaf has become a daily habit.

Sat today

[Jishin]

Hi Ade,

I feel better when I read less and sit more.

Gassho, Jishin, _/st\_

[Joyo]

Rich, Jishin (and many others here!) good points indeed!! I like to read dharma books, and listen to dharma youtube videos, but those things have become just whatever they may be, with no pressure or goal as to how much I will do or not do. I like to sit, and as others have said it has just become part of my daily routine. Oftentimes, my feet do not even touch the floor, the in the mornings, before I sit.

I felt very much like you Ade, until I wrote down a little routine for myself in my journal(I loooove to journal ). I have daily practices (sitting morning and evening, metta in the morning, atonement at night) and weekly (zazenkai) just to give you an example. This has worked well for me, and I have found that by sticking to this, I no longer get obsessed about unnecessary expectations I may put on myself to do more. And sometimes life gets really busy and demanding and I do not do all of the things on my list, but that's ok, I just pick up where I left off and start again.

Gassho,
Joyo
sat today

[Joyo]

And like playing an instrument, keep it interesting and enjoyable (nobody said Buddhism had to be a painful grind ... even if there are grindy days sometimes) and keep practicing at a nice, steady pace. Play the music that makes your heart sing.

Some good advice from folks above.

Gassho, J

SatToday

This makes me recall something I heard TNH say on youtube that was quite funny. He was giving a serious talk on some sort of Buddhist teaching, and he said something like there is enough pain in the world, practicing Buddhism shouldn't be added to that. Anyway, the way he said it was quite funny and it got the whole crowd laughing.

Gassho,
Joyo
sat today

[adrianbkelly]

Thanks everyone for the great advice! It's good to know that I'm not alone in this!

I tend to have a few obsessive tendencies; when I find a film director or musician I like, I have to see & hear everything they've made. When I first started practising, in the Theravada tradition, I wanted to become a monk ASAP! Thankfully, when I went to speak to a Bhikkhu about this, he ignored my request & taught me metta bhavana instead!

I'm going to do my best to stick to the basics for now, sitting daily, practicing the precepts & joining the Zazenkais when I can, whilst making sure I allow time for other things (in fact, my wife & i are undergoing IVF treatment at the moment, so I'm hoping I'll have no option but to re-prioritise my time soon! ) I'll try limiting my Zen-related reading to once or twice a week.

Thanks again everyone & I hope to stick around for ther long term!

_/\_
Ade
Started sitting again today

[Kyotai]

Hi Ade,

All these responses shows you are definitely not alone on this topic. And by the way, good luck to you and your wife with your IVF treatments

Gassho, Kyotai
sat today

[Cumminjd]

Though i have never felt this way about Zen, and my practice, I have felt this in other areas of my life. I think this is because I separated my practice from my ever changing excitement for things, if that makes sense. I get really excited for things, then ill get excited for something else, and forget about the first thing. But my practices (both Zen and Qigong) have stuck with me because I was never excited for them per se. It is as if this is just something I do, like sleeping. Its part of my schedule. Im not sure if this is helpful in any way, maybe not. Maybe I'm just talking for no real reason haha. Anyway even when your not practicing, your still practicing.

Gassho,
James
Sat Today

[Meishin]

Hi,

I like the idea that this is a marathon, not a sprint.

Gassho
Meishin
Sat today

[Troy]

Hi,

I like the idea that this is a marathon, not a sprint.

Gassho
Meishin
Sat today

Thank you. That was something I needed to hear today.


..sat2day•

[Jakugan]

Hi Ade.

Like others I also have similar issues. Pm me if you ever want to have a short sit together.

Gassho,

simon.

sat today

[rego]

Hey Ade, thank you for making this thread. And thank you to everyone for their helpful comments. I am trying to find that balance as well and it is good to know that we're not alone.

Thank you!

Andrew

Sat today

[Meredith]

Looks like I'm not the only one with obsessive tendencies. Lots of good advice here--thanks to all!

Gassho,

Meredith

SatToday

[Meredith]

I have daily practices (sitting morning and evening, metta in the morning, atonement at night) and weekly (zazenkai) just to give you an example.

Joyo, I'm not familiar with atonement practice (forgive me if it's been discussed here and I've missed it). I've looked around online a little bit, and found a couple of atonement rituals but they don't appear to be a daily practice kind of ritual:

http://buddhism.about.com/od/chanand.../a/fusatsu.htm

http://www.cloudwater.org/uploads/te.../Atonement.pdf

Would you elaborate a bit about atonement? Thanks so much!

Gassho,

Meredith

SatToday

[Mp]

I'm not familiar with atonement practice

Hello Meredith,

In our Weekly/Monthly chant book we have the verse of atonement. =)

http://www.treeleaf.org/treeleaf_zaz...chant_book.pdf

But I notice that is the old one, the new one has just a small change in the first and second line ...

All harmful words, thoughts, and acts
Ever committed by me since of Old
On account of beginning-less greed, anger and ignorance
Born of my body, mouth and mind
Now I atone for them all.

For me Meredith Atonement is awareness of my actions and to try my best to learn from the ones that may cause harm or upset. We are human and we make mistakes, but the positive note of making mistakes is it gives us a wonderful opportunity to learn and grow ... it's not about blame or judgement, but about opening our hearts and minds to those possibilities. =)

Hope that helps. =)

Gassho
Shingen

[Ishin]

This has been a very timely post for me to read. I have been lax at least in my participation here lately because there has been and endless cascade of circumstances overtaking a good deal of my free time. I tend to get fixated on taking care of one thing at a time and other things fall aside. I really like Yugen's suggestion of a dharma partner, yet I do feel like you are all my partners, and I am not just saying that. Treeleaf is a very supportive place!

One thing I might suggest is for us all to look at the the patterns we develop. For example, do you only sit when things are good in your life? Do you only sit when things are bad? Do you sit as escapism or as regular practice? Is there a common thread to your own patterns that is discernible. For me I am not sure. This is the first period I have been "away" from practice since I started. I can honestly say I am not really sure what happened, other than a "feeling" that my life was overwhelming.

Gassho
Ishin

Sat Today!

[Kyotai]

Great comment Ishin. Thank you for sharing.

Gassho, Kyotai
sat today

[Shinchi]

Just wanted to say thank you for all the advice posted here. This is something I have struggled with often as well...

Gassho

SatToday


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Meredith]

In our Weekly/Monthly chant book we have the verse of atonement. =)

Ah, okay--I didn't make the connection for some reason. Thank you!

Gassho,
Meredith

SatToday