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Thread: Treeleaf Google+ community ... time to change ?

  1. #1

    Treeleaf Google+ community ... time to change ?

    Hello everyone,
    as some of you posted in other threads there was a pretty nasty change in Google+ communities recently, well its a few weeks actually. When you start a hangout and invite the Treeleaf community you see an alert top right "You just made this video call public" and as some of you expreienced, its indeed public and after having visitors more than once which started a wild discussion while I was sitting I thought its time to further investigate this.
    To make it short: There is no quick and easy fix currently, the only way would be to start over with a "new" community. My proposal is to do exactly this, creating a new community which has the right settings (no, they cant be changed later on), so our hangouts are private (which means only visible to community members).
    If its ok with Jundo I can take care of that in January, and find a way to make it as smooth as possible for everyone. This is just my idea, please feel free to discuss ...

    Gassho, Happy new year and thank you
    Myoku

  2. #2
    Treeleaf Unsui/Engineer Kyonin's Avatar
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    Hi Myoku,

    I think it's a good idea, but lets wait and see what our teachers say.

    Staying in G+ is a good idea because we all have accounts and the service is free. In my experience it works pretty nice, but there have been a lot of complains about this. My bet is that they will fix it sooner or later.

    One can only hope.

    Happy New Year to you too

    Gassho,

    Kyonin
    Please remember I am only a priest in training. I could be wrong in everything I say. Slap me if needed.

    The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one. Mr. Spock

  3. #3
    Hi Guys,

    Please do whatever you feel needs doing.

    When I start the Hangout for the Zazenkai, it seems to let me unselect "Public" (in other words, "Public" is invited by default, but I can remove it from the invitations). So, so far, no problem with public folks dropping in suddenly.

    On the other hand, the new system seemed not to let me start the Hangout with our "Treeleaf Zendo" Community (which I had used in the past), but only with our "Sangha Members" Circle. The "Sangha Members" Circle does not include many of our regular sitters.

    So, yes, seems like a good plan to start a new Circle for Zazen sitters. Please keep us posted, Myozan.

    Gassho, J
    ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

    #SAT TODAY!

  4. #4
    Senior Member Shujin's Avatar
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    Thank you for looking into this, Myoku. It's been bothering me (and others, surely), but I hadn't thought of a way to resolve the issue.

    Gassho,
    Shujin


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  5. #5
    Senior Member Myosha's Avatar
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    Hello,

    Well done.

    Thank you.


    Gassho,
    Edward
    Practice with humility, respect all beings, avoid attachments, give rise to praj˝a from your own awareness, put an end to delusions - Hui-neng

  6. #6
    Friend of Treeleaf Myozan Kodo's Avatar
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    Hi Myoku.
    Thanks for this. Something needs to be done. Is it that our Treeleaf community has a public default that we can't change? But can select if we set up a new community? Cool if we can. Can't we also delete the original community and set it up again, inviting all to rejoin?

    Gassho
    Myozan
    Myozan Kodo
    Ordained Soto Zen Priest in Training
    Dublin, Ireland

    As a trainee priest, please take any commentary by me on matters of the Dharma with a pinch of salt.
    "Here the way unfolds."

  7. #7
    Treeleaf Unsui Shokai's Avatar
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    I think we need to start a new community with new settings, Unfortunately, everyone needs to re-join but, it'll be cleaner

    gassho,

    Sent from my Note 2 using Tapatalk4
    gassho, Shokai, still learning the way and knowing nothing
    仁道 生開 - Jindo Shokai "Open to life in a benevolent way"
    Just another itinerant monk; go somewhere else to listen to someone who really knows.

  8. #8
    Great Myoku ... I know we are wonderful hands. =)

    Gassho
    Shingen
    倫道 真現

    As a trainee priest, please take any commentary by me on matters of the Dharma with a pinch of salt.

  9. #9
    Treeleaf Unsui Dosho's Avatar
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    My first reaction was to say, "Wait, let's think about this first!" But, Myoku, clearly you have already. I can think of no one better to leave this task to in the sangha.

    Thank you my brother for addressing this.

    Gassho,
    Dosho
    Ordained Priest -In-Training & Shuso (Head Seat) for November - Ango 2014
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Please take what I say with a grain of salt, especially in matters of the Dharma!

  10. #10

    Jukai procedure

    Hey Guys,

    I just want to run this by you fellows:

    I am going to use Google+ for the Jukai this time, just like last year. I will have two separate hangouts going on two computers (running on two separate internet Wifi connections each with good bandwidth), as seen here ...



    I had two different Google+ pages going, one our usual Treeleaf page that we use for Zazenkai each week ...

    https://plus.google.com/116930448607190706458/posts

    and a special one I set up for Jukai ...

    https://plus.google.com/b/1124127938...09963606/posts

    In order to do that, I intend to set up two new "circles" of folks who will join in the Jukai (to be called something like "Jukai 1" circle and "Jukai 2" circle. This is the same procedure I followed last year (and also for the recent Rohatsu, when I set up a special circle of folks who would be sitting the Retreat live).

    I will invite anyone of our Jukaiers not yet registered with Google+ to do so this week, assuming they wish to appear on Camera. I will point them to our current registration instructions ...

    http://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showt...E-for-Zazenkai

    Once they register, I will add them on my side to the "Jukai 1" and "Jukai 2" circles.

    As far as you know, is that sufficient to get them set up?

    Gassho, Jundo
    Last edited by Jundo; 01-05-2014 at 02:13 AM.
    ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

    #SAT TODAY!

  11. #11
    That looks like a great idea Jundo ... went very well last time. =)

    Gassho
    Shingen
    倫道 真現

    As a trainee priest, please take any commentary by me on matters of the Dharma with a pinch of salt.

  12. #12
    Treeleaf Unsui Dosho's Avatar
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    Jundo,

    Since it is what you did last time and it worked, I can't see any reason it wouldn't work this time.

    Is there a specific concern you have about any of the steps?

    Gassho,
    Dosho
    Ordained Priest -In-Training & Shuso (Head Seat) for November - Ango 2014
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Please take what I say with a grain of salt, especially in matters of the Dharma!

  13. #13
    Hi D,

    I am just wondering because of all the recent changes to Google+ interface we have been discussing.

    Also, I am telling people the following. Is it still correct?

    About 30 minutes before the ceremony, I will open the hangouts and you will receive an email notice that they are open. You can then follow the link to join the hangout to which you have been assigned. We can seat up to 18 people (9 in each hangout), so should have plenty of room for all Jukai recipients.
    Gassho, J
    ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

    #SAT TODAY!

  14. #14
    Treeleaf Unsui/Engineer Kyonin's Avatar
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    Hi Jundo,

    I think that will be the right procedure to have both hangouts running.

    And opening the hangouts 30 minutes before the ceremony is great because we can make tests if things don't work as they should.

    Let us know if you need help.

    Gassho,

    Kyonin
    Please remember I am only a priest in training. I could be wrong in everything I say. Slap me if needed.

    The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one. Mr. Spock

  15. #15
    Treeleaf Unsui Dosho's Avatar
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    Jundo,

    I agree with Kyonin that your procedure is sound.

    I have already had one person ask if I could do a test hangout with him this week as he is inexperienced with G+. Perhaps you could suggest people do something similar if they are able.

    I plan to be monitoring the forum starting about an hour before the ceremony starts in case folks have problems.

    Gassho,
    Dosho

    Quote Originally Posted by Jundo View Post
    Hi D,

    I am just wondering because of all the recent changes to Google+ interface we have been discussing.

    Also, I am telling people the following. Is it still correct?

    Gassho, J
    Ordained Priest -In-Training & Shuso (Head Seat) for November - Ango 2014
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Please take what I say with a grain of salt, especially in matters of the Dharma!

  16. #16
    Good morning everyone,

    Quote Originally Posted by Jundo View Post

    I had two different Google+ pages going, one our usual Treeleaf page that we use for Zazenkai each week ...

    https://plus.google.com/116930448607190706458/posts

    and a special one I set up for Jukai ...

    https://plus.google.com/b/1124127938...09963606/posts
    Ok, this are not only two different pages but two different users, which I believe make sense!

    In order to do that, I intend to set up two new "circles" of folks who will join in the Jukai (to be called something like "Jukai 1" circle and "Jukai 2" circle. This is the same procedure I followed last year (and also for the recent Rohatsu, when I set up a special circle of folks who would be sitting the Retreat live).
    I think its good, you would need to have one circle in the "usual" page/user and one circle for the Treeleaf Jukai 1 page/user, right ?

    I will invite anyone of our Jukaiers not yet registered with Google+ to do so this week, assuming they wish to appear on Camera. I will point them to our current registration instructions ...

    http://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showt...E-for-Zazenkai

    Once they register, I will add them on my side to the "Jukai 1" and "Jukai 2" circles.

    As far as you know, is that sufficient to get them set up?
    This should almost perfectly do it. I believe people who are in the circle you run from page/user "Treeleaf Jukai 1" need to circle this user to actually receive the notification! I'm always pretty defensive when it comes to such extraordinary procedures and while its good to start early I always recommend a test run. Maybe one day earlier ? Not everyone needs to be there, maybe just a few guys, I could be a test-guy for one group on Saturday afternoon. Such a test can be done in 10 Minutes of all goes well.

    Gassho
    Myoku

  17. #17
    ...one more, I'm pretty clar about how to re-setup Treeleaf so we run it privately, but wont do anything before we did Jukai well
    Gassho
    Myoku

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Myoku View Post
    ...one more, I'm pretty clar about how to re-setup Treeleaf so we run it privately, but wont do anything before we did Jukai well
    Gassho
    Myoku
    Thanks Myoku. I have been having no problem with privacy during the Zazenkais, as I uncheck "public" when I start the hangouts. Hopefully, that will be the same this time too.

    Gassho, J
    ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

    #SAT TODAY!

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Jundo View Post
    I have been having no problem with privacy during the Zazenkais, as I uncheck "public" when I start the hangouts. Hopefully, that will be the same this time too.
    I only wanted to indicate that I wont introduce any changes before Jukai

  20. #20
    Senior Member Myosha's Avatar
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    Hello,

    May I respectfully suggest names for the "circles"? - Jukai 0 and Jukai 1.


    Gassho,
    Edward
    Practice with humility, respect all beings, avoid attachments, give rise to praj˝a from your own awareness, put an end to delusions - Hui-neng

  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by drocloce View Post
    May I respectfully suggest names for the "circles"? - Jukai 0 and Jukai 1.
    The names of the circles are only visible to Jundo (and other admins on these accounts) anyway, you wont see them, nobody will. Google for privacy reasons only allows you to see WHO circled you, but not in which circle you were added.
    The accounts which are used were mentioned by Jundo:

    Gassho
    Myoku

  22. #22
    Senior Member Juki's Avatar
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    Myoku: I continue to receive no invitations to anything. I did not get an invitation to Jukai or to any recent Zazenkai. Sometimes, through here dumb luck, I find my way into a Zazenkai hangout, but not often. This was never a problem until recently.

    Gassho,
    William
    "First you have to give up." Tyler Durden

  23. #23
    Treeleaf Unsui Dosho's Avatar
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    William,

    No one received G+ invites to today's jukai...not sure what that was about, but it wasn't just you. And I believe Jundo said jukaiees would be contacted by email, not as an invite on G+.

    Gassho,
    Dosho
    Ordained Priest -In-Training & Shuso (Head Seat) for November - Ango 2014
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Please take what I say with a grain of salt, especially in matters of the Dharma!

  24. #24
    Senior Member Juki's Avatar
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    I understand that, Dosho. I looked for both an e-mail and a G+ invite, but received neither. It looks like this was a problem for several people this morning. But it also happens lately on Friday nights. I see the live feed for the Zazenkais, I get there really early, when there are only two or three people in the hangout, but I never get any prompt to join the hangout. Just wondering if I am doing something wrong on my end. Thank you for your patience.

    Gassho,
    William
    "First you have to give up." Tyler Durden

  25. #25
    Treeleaf Unsui Dosho's Avatar
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    William,

    I appreciate your frustration and patience.

    Concerning jukai, did you contact Jundo as discussed in the following post?

    http://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showt...l=1#post118891

    As for zazenkai, I do not get an invitation to zazenkai either and often have to keep refreshing the Treeleaf Sangha G+ page to see the hangout.

    Gassho,
    Dosho

    Quote Originally Posted by William Anderson View Post
    I understand that, Dosho. I looked for both an e-mail and a G+ invite, but received neither. It looks like this was a problem for several people this morning. But it also happens lately on Friday nights. I see the live feed for the Zazenkais, I get there really early, when there are only two or three people in the hangout, but I never get any prompt to join the hangout. Just wondering if I am doing something wrong on my end. Thank you for your patience.

    Gassho,
    William
    Ordained Priest -In-Training & Shuso (Head Seat) for November - Ango 2014
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Please take what I say with a grain of salt, especially in matters of the Dharma!

  26. #26
    Hi Guys,

    We made it through once again despite losing the connection for a few minutes. I believe that was caused on my end, not Google+ this time.

    However, the problem with viewers being unable to watch is another matter. The cause seems to be the new Google+ interface, which never did this in earlier incarnations. I was wondering why it now asks me twice about who to invite, once when creating the event and again after the event starts. Apparently, once is for inviting general viewers and once is for participants ... and all I have to do now is figure out which is which!

    So, when I simply invited the Jukai-ees both times, it locked out other viewers.

    Gassho, J
    Last edited by Jundo; 01-13-2014 at 08:28 AM.
    ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

    #SAT TODAY!

  27. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Juki View Post
    I understand that, Dosho. I looked for both an e-mail and a G+ invite, but received neither. It looks like this was a problem for several people this morning.
    Hello William,
    same here, no mail no invite via g+, but the hangout appeared on my stream and so I entered. Its pretty difficult to keep up with software changes at g+, will keep watching out for the simplest and reliable way to manage this and let you folks know.

    @all, I'll be sending out invites within the next 24 hours to everyone joining a new Treeleaf community, which will be set up slightly differently. The first time we set it up as public (because at the time the community was created public means people outside the community can find the community but cannot join hangouts). But Google decided that pubic also needs to mean everyone can join your hangout which is a bit ... not so good to have all kinds of strange people join your zazen hangout.

    Thank you everyone for your patience.
    Gassho
    Myoku

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